Raw Transcript: Joe Rogan Experience #2416 - Dan Farah

Joe Rogan podcast. Check it out. The Joe Rogan Experience. Train by day. Joe Rogan podcast by night. All day. Uh what's up, Dan? How are you? Good to see you. Good. Good to see you. Good to see you again. Uh first time I saw you was the first time I saw your documentary, which is [ __ ] excellent. Thank you, bro. Uh The Age of Disclosure. Really good. Can't recommend it enough. If you're a UFO dork like myself and you're in and out like sometimes like this is [ __ ] maybe it's real. This is [ __ ] Maybe I'm wasting my time. Maybe it's real. Maybe it's Go see the age of disclosure and then you'll be fully in the I don't [ __ ] know, but who? Something's going on. That's where I am right now. I don't know, but something's going on. Definitely something going on. It's a real situation. Yeah, it's a real weird one when you see all these like highlevel government employees talking about secret access programs and back engineering programs that have been going on for decades and decades and secrecy and you're like your documentary did a fantastic job of highlighting a couple of reasons why I always when people are skeptical and they go okay if there was a program like this why wouldn't they just tell us you you have to really understand the consequences of what they've done cuz What they've done is lied to Congress for a long time. It's misappropriation of funds, clear felonies, like lied to the public, lied to Congress, lied to sitting presidents, just the money stuff. And also, let's just be really, let's be just honest about human nature. If you have complete access to enormous amounts of money that's not under any oversight at all, for sure. Some of it some of it went in the pockets of people that probably shouldn't have got it. 100%. I think it's safe to say 100% has to. Everyone I've talked to who's aware of the details of the Deeply Hidden Legacy program says that it's at least over a trillion dollars spent since the 40s. It's an enormous amount of money and it's a much bigger program than people would suspect. You're talking thousands of people full-time jobs, then going home to their families. The guy sitting next to your kids little league baseball game, you know, normal people on the outside are involved in this deeply hidden program. It's bonkers. And the idea, this is another thing that drives me nuts. The idea that people can't keep secrets. Shut the [ __ ] up. Yes, they can. If you're told you're some people, some people can't keep secrets, but by the time you get to be a highle operative in the United States government, I'm guessing you can keep a [ __ ] secret. Yeah. And if you're told, yeah, hey, you could just disappear one day or you can have your reputation ruined, right? You're gonna get blackmailed about this or that. You're just gonna keep quiet. Yeah, people can keep secrets. And by the way, not everybody does. The Bob Lazar story to this day is like that that documentary by Jeremy Corbel was the reason why I went all the way back in with UFOs. I'm like, "All right, god damn it. I believe Bob." It's a great doc. It's a great doc. Great talk. And that that one's available. It's uh Area 50, Bob Lazar, Area 51 and Flying Saucers. Is that the name of it? The title of it? Something along those lines. Fantastic documentary for me. Like I look, my childhood was the 80s and early 90s. So I grew up on movies like ET and Close Encounters and TV shows like X Files and movies like Fire in the Sky. Remember that movie? Oh, yeah. I had Travis in here. Yeah, you did. I love that interview. Fantastic. That movie That movie gave me nightmares. Crazy. Kept me up as a kid. All those a couple of those guys on that crew hated him. Like one of them he got in a fist fight with that day. Yeah. Yeah. And that guy had the exact same story that everybody else had. He got hit by a beam of light. They went back to get him. He was gone. Then 5 days later, he shows up. He's not malnourished. He's not like he's not hasn't been sleeping in the woods. It's crazy. And he's got this [ __ ] insane story about being repaired on a UFO. Yeah. And all those guys pass lie detector test. Yes. All of them did. The uh you know, like movies like that. I'm sure for millions people around the world, same thing. It just made me curious about this. you know, my whole life I'm like, are we alone in the universe? Does the US government know more about this than than we do, right? And I always wish that there was a documentary that only interviewed people who have direct knowledge of the topic as a result of working for the government. And that was that was the real drive of making this film. Everybody fits that criteria. Here's the fear that everyone has, including myself, and it it is the way this this is the main fear that I have whenever I sit down with any whistleblower. Um, how many of them are on purpose that their directive that their ob their objective is to spread misinformation on purpose on behalf of the government that they're they're there to just [ __ ] you? Yeah. Now, of course, I had that I had that thought. For me, I stopped worrying about that when I met one intelligence official, government official, military official after another who had completely different ideological views, different political beliefs. They weren't associate with each other, and they were all saying the same thing. Mhm. And so I just don't the the alternative to everything these people are saying in my film being true is that 34 people of different political parties, different government groups with different aspirations all got together four years ago and decided to tell this elaborate lie randomly with me in a movie. Mhm. And for what end? Well, doesn't make any sense. There is a couple ends, right? One of them could be they're being told to do this because this is a real thing, but it's different than what they're saying, and they're trying to get one narrative out there. Well, right, look at let's imagine that there's a current coordinated effort with the United States government and some sort of alien intelligence. Wouldn't it behoove you to make it more of a mystery? like we've been trying, we've been we have found things but we don't know what they are. We're back engineering but we don't know much. Meanwhile, they know way more. Well, yeah. Look, like that's just one scenario. That could be a scenario. But in this case, you have people who like like Rubio who found out what's going on, who think it is very urgent that the public get caught up and find out the base facts. Yeah, his biggest fear clearly is we are in a highstakes technology race, a cold war race with adversarial nations like China to reverse engineer technology of non-human origin. And his fear, he literally says in the film, is that if we don't get our act together and take this more seriously as a country, we're going to wake up one day, we're going to find out the hard way that China got there. We won't know when or how, but to quote him, we will be screwed. And he, you could feel it, like I did all the interviews myself. I'm like this close to him. His chin buckled when he said it. He was dead serious and he was super concerned and you could feel it and that was the vibe with Senator Rounds, Senator Gillibrand, Jim Clapper, guy's never talked about this topic in his life. He's in his 80s. He was the head of air force intelligence. He was the director of national intelligence. Never publicly spoken about UAP. He goes on, he comes out and does the interview and he told me, excuse me, he told me that he was doing it because it was important to do and that the people needed to know. and he he drops the bomb in the film that that UAP activity over Area 51 is real. It's in fact real. And he goes on the record saying that the Air Force has had a program to investigate this stuff, whereas the Air Force is saying they haven't had a program since Project Blue Book. So I think the people that I interviewed really felt like a weight on their shoulders to get this off their chest. And to give you more context on Clapper, the guy, the poor guy's wife was in the hospital dying. He left the hospital to come do the interview. And I actually said to him, I was like, "Are you sure you want to do this today?" And he's like, "No, I want to do it. It's important." Wow. So, like I think I I really felt it. These people all felt like the public needed to know the base facts that they could lawfully disclose. And to me, the more wild thing is if this is if what they reveal in this film, the fact that there's been an 80-year cover up of non-human intelligent life, that we're in a secret highstakes race with adversarial nations, if that's what they can lawfully disclose, dude, what's on the other side of that line, what's the stuff they can't disclose, right? You know? Yeah. Um, when you're talking to these people, how many of them have had uh personal experiences that they either can or cannot talk about or how many of them has anyone had some sort of personal experience with either a craft or seen something Yeah. Yeah. So, that they couldn't talk about that they there was some scenarios that they couldn't talk about and then there were some scenarios they could talk about. Um but yes uh Jay Stratton for example who ran the US government's UAP task force he was the director of task force he co-founded OAP with Jim Macsky which grew into ATIP. Um he has seen with his own eyes non-human craft and non-human beings. Some situations that he can't talk about some situations that he he can. And I know he intends to talk about those in the very near future. Yeah, I've talked to him. Um, so is that the only one that saw a nonhuman being that you talked to? No, talked to couple people who have. And were they similar stories? They were similar stories. They they they described the beings looking the reference point they gave me was very similar to the beings depicted in Close Encounters. That is the description they used. Yeah. the um in terms of the crafts, one of the interviews in the film that I'm really proud of, um an Air Force security guard who worked at Vanderberg Air Force Base, who's never gone public, witnessed with his own eyes along with five other security forces members, a giant UAP the size of a football field that came over Vandenberg Air Force Base, hovered over them, and then shot off at thousands of miles an and he went on the record on camera. He's never talked about it publicly. He's never pursued press or, you know, tried to do anything with this experience, right? And he broke his silence in this film because he thought it was really important that the world know the truth. Did you ask him if there's any footage? I would imagine Vanderberg has some pretty tight security. Yeah, he thinks that there is uh security camera footage of this, but he's never seen it. He's never seen it. No. Good lord. Him and five. It was him and five other guys saw it with their own eyes. They all reported it. There's official um Air Force police blogger reports of it. I got a hold of the the police report. We put it on screen in the film. That's what drives me crazy. All this could be cleared up if they released the whatever high resolution security camera footage they have. I I would imagine they have topnotch sec camera footage around major military facilities. Yeah. Right. That's one of the hurdles we have to get past. We have to these [ __ ] are holding on. got to [ __ ] It's just like if that's shouldn't be yours. Like that should be the United States government has an obligation to give that to the people of the world. That's what that should be. If you have footage of a [ __ ] UFO, a real one. Yeah. And you really have a video of it going thousands of miles an hour just disappearing into the sky. Yeah. 100%. I mean, I don't think any government or organization or religion, anyone should be able to gateep these fundamental facts, you know? I know. But the problem is until you see it, it's just talk. You know, if you saw it and you know that you you you know the like the chain of command like where it came from or chain of custody rather where it came from. It's hasn't been molested. Have analyst tested. It's not AI. It's not [ __ ] It's not edited. Okay. What is it? Yeah. And then we can talk. But until then, like what do we have? We have the go fast footage. We have the gimbal footage. And we have uh the very uh kind of grainy weird Tik Tok footage. It's hard to tell what it is because you're looking at it from the instrumentation of the fighter jets. Yeah. But there is also other um there is also other uh data on the tic tac incident that's classified that shows this is a real object that was really there. Jamie's showing me something. What are you showing me, Jamie? This is uh Ryan Graves talking about the big red UFO that hovered over Vandenberg in 2003. Yeah. So that happened in the afternoon and then that night this giant craft came over the base that uh is revealed in my film. It was right here. The executive director of the Graves who's been on the podcast for awesome. Ryan Graves is awesome. Uh sighting occurred around 8:45 a.m. followed by a second sighting only hours later. He said witnesses provided him with information about the mysterious incidents as they held on to official documentation and records from the event over the years. Yeah. And so later that night, later in the evening, post sunset, there were reports of other sightings on base, including some aggressive behaviors. These objects were approaching some of the security guards at rapid speeds before darting off. Like Close Encounters, like literally like the movie. Yeah. I just wonder how much Steven Spielberg, I love talking to him about that, how much he dove into it before he made that film, cuz you know, he had the Jacqu Valet character, that French scientist. I think he learned a lot in the 70s. People forget he also wrote Poltergeist, right? Yeah. This guy knew what was going on um early on. But put yourself in the shoes of those security guards at Vanderberg. Can you imagine just being a normal guy? You're working your security shift. You look up and there's something the size of a football field over you hovering map, no windows. It's [ __ ] terrifying and it's crazy. And it he says uh you we did a New York City premiere uh a couple nights ago, Tuesday night. We did it on the Intrepid aircraft carrier. Oh wow. It was awesome. And Fraver and Graves came, which was great to be on an aircraft carrier with, you know, Fraver and Graves. That's awesome. Um, Fraver loved it. He's like, "I'm back on a carrier, baby." The, uh, it was it was classic. But, um, the witness from Vandenberg came and he we did a little talk after for for the audience and he said it changed his life. He just completely looks at everything differently now. Oh, how could it not? Yeah. How could it not? Yeah. I mean, if you see something like that, totally humbling and also, you know, eye opening. Um there's several people in the film, military military guys who talk about what they experienced and saw on military bases, especially nuclear bases. Um which is which is goes back to one of the biggest concerns the leaders in my film have. Almost all the activities over our nuclear weapons sites and military bases, our defense capabilities and our nuclear progress essentially are being monitored. And why is that? Because it's dangerous as [ __ ] because as Terrence McKenna described us, we're territorial uh apes with thermonuclear weapons. Yeah. It's it's ridiculous position. Yeah. And so that's clear to me, too. And and then you think about, okay, well, where does all this go? Like comes to a crossroads, right? Like they've been here a long time. and they've been monitoring us a long time, but now we've evolved to be dangerous and we're either at through secret programs their level or we're about to be and then that's when you get to a crossroad. So I I think that's one of the things driving officials like Rubio and Rounds and Gillibrand and J Strat and um to come out and say what they legally can because it's a set of circumstances that the human population really needs to know about and then it's become a humanitarian issue. How do we deal with this? Right. And what is it right? What is their purpose? If they are real, are they here to help us? Are they monitoring us? One of the creepiest things that Bob Lazar said is that we they look at us like containers. Yeah. I mean, and I was like, what does that mean? Like containers of souls is what I interpreted from it, but that's just me. But like, what does that mean? containers like like I it seems like human beings have in an insatiable desire to innovate and create better technology and that seems to be leading us into AI and seems to be leading us into probably what connects us with the rest of the universe the rest the intelligence of the universe but the stuff that got us here is being these territorial apes you know that's why we developed cities And that's why we developed agriculture. That's why we we had enough free time to innovate. We had enough free time to invent things and change things. But our nature is really what holds us back because we're still constantly waring. Like it hasn't changed at all. No, it's crazy that we're still threatening nuclear war 80 years after, you know, dropping the bomb on Japan. We're still invading sovereign nations. We're involved in a proxy war. We're, you know, we're helping Israel. It's like there's so much chaos and death going on in the world because of human beings and the decisions that they're making that if I was an intelligent life species from somewhere else, I'd be very concerned. Yeah. I'd be like, here's these this group of monkeys on a uh you know, trajectory about to make a digital god, they're real close to having super intelligence in digital form. And the these idiots are still blowing themselves up from the sky. Yeah. Which also is why one of the current dilemmas exists, right? So this this technology exist. Private defense contractors have this technology. Elements of the government have this technology. You're convinced? Beyond beyond convinced. And what do you think that technology consists of? I have been completely convinced by multiple members of the intelligence community, the military, senior leaders in government, people who are running the Senate Armed Services Committee, the Senate Intelligence Committee, someone who sits on the White House National Security Council that our country has recovered dozens dozens of crashed craft of non-human origin and done so since the 40s and there has been success reverse engineering elements of this technology and the same thing has been happening in China and Russia and it's a very real situation. It's a highstakes situation. It is referred to as the atomic race on steroids. And I am completely convinced of that. And the and the contractors that the defense contractors that people like Jay Stratton and Luzando and people on the Senate Intel committee have told me are involved are Lheed Martin, North of Grumman, Rathon, Battel. Um big companies um that have a lot of resources and are advancing this technology. But it's all so classified and so deeply hidden that it hinders progress. And the fear that if this technology got out, it'd be used by bad actors to create weapons of mass destruction has sort of prevented the scientific progress that could be better for mankind, that could be good for mankind. Like this this could this technology to quote Haludov in the film said he says this this is the key to interstellar travel. This is the key to exploring the galaxy. this is the key to, you know, things that sound like science fiction like teleportation. Um, all these things that could just revolutionize humanity and like the trajectory of our species are being held back out of the fear that the technology will be used for evil, right? And so, you know, I love how Pudof I gotten very close with him and, you know, he he makes a fascinating guy, fascinating guy. He's the most interesting person I've ever met in my life. Um uh he makes a great point in the film of saying he believes despite the risks this technology could be used for for bad. He believes we should make it known and make it a humanitarian issue of how we all collectively go about safely using this technology to change the world for the better and avoid destruction. And we've done that. We have a blueprint for that with with nuclear technology, right? Like there are nuclear weapons. That stuff's classified. We wish they didn't exist, but it does exist. And then we also use nuclear energy for good. Yeah. Um the the question would be if we're holding back cuz we're worried that bad actors are going to get it. Is China taking the same approach because I would imagine they're not. They're not. I would imagine they're full bore, full steam ahead. Yeah. And that's that's that's one of the problems like that's the same thing with a lot of other technology, right? Oh yeah. Yeah. Rubio and Rounds and Gillibrand, three of the most senior leaders in our government, um, talk very openly about their concern about China and them getting ahead of us on reverse engineering this technology. Rubio says it keeps them up at night. rounds very animately animatedly says in the film um do you think for one second that they wouldn't use this technology for their domination um if they didn't think we had access to the same technology? How is everybody getting these crashed UFOs? What's the story behind that? So here's an interesting thing. Um, one of the one of the unexpected things I learned in talking to sources like real credible people is that some of the cr some of the the crashes were actual crashes where just you know crashes happen just like they do for you can drive as safe as possible, fly as safe as possible, crashes are going to happen. But some of them were actually caused by elements of our military intelligence community and elements of foreign military intelligence community people. So like one of the realizations early on was that um atomic weapon test nuclear weapon testing atomic weapon testing create has a ripple effect that can down these things especially high altitude nuclear testing which is one of the things that they did in the 1950s in particular. Yeah. And so they started doing it. Yeah. To like shoot fish in a barrel basically. They did it on purpose. Yeah. And so to That's why they were doing it. Yeah. And then Russia Russia started doing it. No. Yeah. And then one of the It's like throwing dynamite into the river. It's like fishing with dynamite. Yeah. Yeah. Fishing with dynamite. Oh my god, that's so crazy. Which is crazy on multiple levels. A, you could accidentally provoke a nuclear conflict with another party that doesn't know what you're doing. B, um, you're, you know, you're picking a fight with a more intelligent, superior species, right? Which is probably not going to work out great for anybody. They probably couldn't believe we were using nukes in the sky. These [ __ ] idiots nuked some of our spaceships and the ocean. Yeah, we nuked the ocean a ton of times and there's a ton of UAP activity in the ocean, right? That's something that Tim Buret re recently talked about. Did you ever did you see that? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I've I've talked off the record with admirals and subcommanders and been told that these giant football-sized crafts that were seen over Vanderberg, for example, have been seen under the ocean. Wow. Moving at crazy speeds, tracked by our subs. Yeah. They they said there was one story of one that was the size of a football field that was going 500 knots. Yeah. Underwater with no ripples. Yeah. So, it makes starts to make you think like not only was Spielberg tipped off early on, but maybe maybe James Cameron was too. Maybe the abyss is a lot closer to reality than than we ever thought. Well, there's always stories about things coming from the ocean. And there was always stories of people that lived in like the Pacific, like on the coast of seeing things come out of the ocean, particularly somewhere around San Diego. There's there's always stories around San Diego there. Yeah. Congressman Carson, Andre Carson, who's on the House Intelligence Committee and on the House Committee for the CIA, he goes on the record in the film saying that these UAP that come out of the ocean are other worldly things. He says they are not man-made aircraft. They are not um rockets. These are other worldly things, he says. And uh that's a significant that was a significant moment for me when he went on the record and said that. And I I think I think it's going back to the the the the nuclear stuff. Um it's scary to think that anyone thought it was a good idea to intentionally take down the aircraft of a more intelligent species. Yeah, it seems like a very foolish decision. Well, if that's true. Yeah, I know that there was a lot of high altitude nuclear bomb testing for whatever reason. And then there was that Operation Midnight Prime. Is that what it was? No. uh Starfish Prime where they were blowing holes through the Van Allen radiation belts. They were just launching nuclear bombs into space. Well, I'll tell you something that I don't I don't think people know about, but um the UAP task force, which Jay Stratton ran, um they put in place a based on that data of, you know, the connection with nukes, they put together a plan uh to lure in UAP with nuclear elements. know nuclear aircraft carrier with some nuclear weapons on it and they had all these data collection systems in place and and it worked. Whoa. So they like put out they Yeah. without causing without doing a test. Just the fact that they had weapons existed and was being put into place it attracted and they caught a lot of data on it. Whoa. And you know we shouldn't think that that was the only time they did that. Well, I would imagine, you know, they probably saw the testing, the stupid [ __ ] we did in the ocean. Yeah. The the fact that, like, we were talking about this last night. John Wayne did a terrible movie called Genghaskhan. I don't if you ever saw it. Yeah. Yeah, I saw that. It's one of the worst movies of all time. And that's what killed him. That movie killed him. He got cancer from that movie. And so did almost like I think it was like close to 100 people on the set. Some very large number of people on the set got cancer because they did this all downwind from where the government was detonating nuclear bombs. They filmed it all in Nevada in the desert. Horrible. Horrible. So like they blew up. So you I'm sure you've seen the video of the where it shows like a time lapse of all the nuclear tests over the years and you just go, "Yo, what are you doing? What are you doing in Nevada? Nevada just boom boom boom boom boom boom boom boom boom." And if I was from another planet, I be like, that's when I would start going, "Oh my god, these idiots." Not only do they have it, but they're just blowing them up in the ocean. No consideration for the fish, the whales, the dolphins, whatever the [ __ ] happens to be there when they drop that thing down. Like, they're they're clearly irresponsible. Yeah. Yeah. No, it's concerning. An analogy that multiple people actually use with me, they said, "Put yourself in the shoes of advanced non human intelligent species." Here, here's the analogy. Imagine you're a zookeeper and you see this gorilla in a cage and it you love this gorilla. It's sweet. You watch you watch it evolve over the years. You see it communicate. It waves to you. You know, you you have no issue with this gorilla. You don't wish it any harm. But what happens if one day you come in and the other security guards say, "Hey, last night the gorilla got out of his cage, walked around the park, was playing with the gun cabinet, and then went back in his cage." You're like, "All right, that's concerning. Let me keep an eye on this." Right? And then and then what happens if you know a month later you come in and they're like, "Hey, the gorilla this time he got in the gun cage. He was playing with the gun and then he went back in his cage with the gun. What do what do we do here?" Right? So that's even worse than that. So it's like we'll take the gun out of his hand. We'll put it back. We'll we'll change the lock and all stuff, right? But then what happens if it evolves to a place where sometime later you come out of your house on a Sunday, you're not even going to work. You got your daughter's hand in your hand and the gorilla is standing on your front lawn with a shotgun. Then you got to make a choice really quick, right? like, do I just take this thing out or do I try to communicate with it and risk my daughter getting shot? And this analogy has been used with me multiple times to describe the dynamic we have with non-human intelligent life and the situation we're barreling towards. Yeah. It would almost be like you went to the cage and the grill was welding and the grill's got on. He's making a boar. He's putting together a shotgun. He's figuring out dynamite out of cleaning. Yeah, that would be the real issue. Like, oh my god, they figured out guns. Because the thing is we figured it out. It's not like somebody gave it to us. You know, look what one of the pe a couple of people in the film reveal that some of the UAP activity we see is non-human intelligent life, but some of it is reverse engineered craft from our program, the legacy program, and some from adversaries. So, I personally think we have cracked this technology a lot more than people realize. I don't think you spend over a trillion dollars and have thousands of people working on a deeply hidden program every year for 80 years and not make progress. Yeah. God, I would love to know what it is that they've done and whether the tic tac is one of ours. I don't think it is. No. No. I talked to everybody who ran actually ran the investigation of the tic tac from various agencies and to the pilots. No one no one thinks it's man-made really. And also, if it was man-made, that would mean that someone cracked a new energy source that far back, which is like what, 20 years at this point, right? Um, and has never used it to benefit our country or another country to solve the energy crisis, to make a superior craft that we've seen used. It's just, it's just hard to believe that no one would use that to like fuel their economy. I mean, it'd be it'd be like a total, you know, restart of everything if you had that technology, right? Yeah, that's interesting. Right. I mean, the craft with that that Tic Tac was going from sea level to 80,000 ft, which is space, and hovering at in space, going back down, hovering at sea level, and doing this for hours. We we don't have anything. the one of the scientists who was involved in one of the UAP programs for the government in my film does the math and says the energy required to do that is the electrical output of the entire United States for I think he said a week some stupid amount of energy required I think it's even more than a week but yeah I remember him saying that it's it's it's bonkers and I don't think it's human trip up yeah and they were doing that all day all day yeah it's crazy it's crazy right if they had that in 200 4 which is the tic tac incident you would think there would be some just insane progress. Yeah. Yeah. So if it's not ours Yeah. What what is the predominant theory of what they are? The predominant theory is that they is multiple species and there's no one answer. Everyone I talked to who has real visibility to the crash retrieval program says the non-human bodies that have been recovered in some of these crafts all look different. There are there are multiple species. The universe is full of life. How many different species? I've heard of at least four body types that were recovered. So, all I've heard of is the grays, which is like the close encounters of the third kind ones. The Nordics, which is the also known as like the tall whites, right? Is that the same thing? I've heard people. Yeah. And then there is uh the reptilians. People talk about reptilians being the scariest one. No one's ever used that word with me to be honest. Really? Yeah. And then there's mantis. There's uh ones that are like insect like. I've heard people say that yet. I haven't heard of any more than that. Yeah. Well, um I've also heard multiple military people talk about little beings that almost look like ET little little bots that don't don't seem sentient that seem like they're they're um almost like like a robot. Yeah. Like a robot almost. Yeah. Some artificial creation maybe. Yeah, maybe you would imagine if you get to genetic engineering and and when there's cyborgs and you integrate technology with this genetic engineering, you're going to be able to create like workers. Yeah. Like little That's what many people have thought the grays are. Like there's small grays that are they they're more in like a workforce capacity. They just do the bidding of the taller grays which seem to be more intelligent. Just I've heard that. You know, one of the one of the um one of the really interesting things is that there's no one answer, right? Like some some nonhuman intelligent life that's here might might have benign intentions and some might have bad intentions, right? We don't know. Um the the other the other reason I am extremely convinced that this situation is entirely real is the access I got when making the film was really an unprecedented level. Like I I got very close with the leadership of the Senate Intelligence Committee and the Senate Armed Services Committee. They were introducing me to people. They were opening doors for me and some of the people that I met through them were actually involved in recovery programs and were going to do interviews and then ultimately decided not to and that they thought they thought it would cost them their lives. Two people used the same words with me actually. It was very interesting. Two people used the words, "After careful consideration, I've decided I would be forfeiting my life if I participated on camera in your film." The word forfeiting, which I never heard anyone use in that kind of a context, right? So, put yourself in my shoes. Like, I'm a normal guy from Jersey making a making a movie about something I'm interested in. The last thing I want to hear is something like that, you know? So, that's the most sure way to get people to keep secrets. Oh, yeah. So, I of course was like that. That's shocking and disappointing to hear. Obviously, we should stop talking. I don't want you in this movie. Do not want that on my conscious. But it also was another another sign that how real all this is? Without naming any names, is there anything that you couldn't talk about in the film that you could tell us without like quoting anybody or pinning it on anybody? Yeah, I mean there's a lot of stuff I learned off the record. Um hopefully it all comes out and people can legally talk about it at some point, but um Can you talk about I know there's been I know there's been multiple contact events like straight up like straight up contact events. One of them is revealed in the film actually, but there are more. Um, there was this several of the people I film talk about an event that happened at Helerman Air Force Base where two non-human crafts approached the base, one landed, beings walked out and interacted with Air Force officials and CIA officials. And a couple people go on the record talking about that in the film, but there have been other events I've been told. How were those beings described? They were described as tall, slender, humanoid. And the um another thing that I heard that gave me chills was that uh someone involved with a uh a recovery um interacted with a non-human being that was dying and heard thoughts in his head that said, "You humans don't know your full potential." And that was said to me by a very senior older guy from the intelligence community. And um I thought that was pretty pretty incredible. Um also just the extent to which the legacy program is real. It's not this isn't like 50 guys, you know, sitting in a quiet dark room. You're talking about a massive program with thousands of people going to work every day and dealing with this. And to me that is mind-blowing, you know. Yeah. you know, the the the guy the you know, the guy next to you at the pizza place, you know, on a Saturday night might be working on this during the day. You know, the guy who, you know, the other father at your kids's like, you know, little league game, this is what he deals with, right? The fact that that is a thing. And, you know, we had we had a similar dynamic for the Manhattan project. There were always people working on it and they kept it secret, right? And their neighbors and friends didn't know. But this is that on steroids. You know, after the Manhattan project, which was bill had a budget in the billions, this situation arose and it had to be even more secret than the Manhattan project because the Manhattan project, we found out in hindsight, leaked, right? There were moles, right? So, we needed to make this even more secret and give it more money and more resources and more, you know, counter intel and more threats, which is counter intel. Yeah. Yeah. mean threats if you re reveal those secrets. But it's like more the more this stuff gets discussed, the more I go back to what Lazar said because what Lazar is describing from the 1980s is exactly what these people are saying now that they've had these things. They've been trying to figure them out. They've been working on them. at least in the 1980s. They hadn't totally cracked it yet, but they did know how to operate them and that they would run do these tests, but everything was so compartmentalized. He said he wasn't allowed to talk to the metallurgist. The he was a the there was different people that were assigned to it. What they were assigned to do was to try to figure out how the propulsion system worked. Yeah. And then there was other people that were assigned to try to figure out how the metallurgy was formed cuz whatever it was seemed like it was 3D printed. It didn't have any seams. Yeah. And when he talks about it, it it sounds exactly like what people are talking about today, which is really bananas because this is late 1980s and he's the first guy to crack through with this stuff. Yeah. Everything is so in in that secret program, everything is so siloed out where you could have one team of defense contractors working on one thing. They're not even told it's from an alien spacecraft. They're just told, "Here's the thing. It might be Russia. It might be China. Tell us how it works." and they're just kept in a little bubble. Um, and one of the issues now is that everything's become so overclassified and so siloed that it's it's actually hurting progress. And that's a lot of the scientists in my film are voicing that. And um you know one of the other things I learned recently that um isn't in the film um Jay Stratton you know who ran the UP task force he told me that during during that time he had started a talk with one of the senior scientists at Lockheed who was frustrated by how overclassified everything was. made them it it even made it hard for the defense contractors to get the right manpower and brains on it cuz not everyone can be cleared to do the work, right? There's all these like red tape hurdles to progress, right? And so they had made a plan to move one of the crafts that had been recovered that was in Lockheed's possession into the possession of the UAP task force. And then the task force was going to be able to put more brain power towards it. And then the head of science and technology at the CIA shut it down in the middle of the transfer. They had actually secured a hanger on a military base and prepped it to to be a classified hanger that would hold this craft and they were stopped. So the issue over Did they know what happened after that? Yeah. The the CIA just shut the CIA shut the shut the whole transaction down and the craft stayed in Lockheed's possession and then that particular leader within Lockheed died about two years later. Um so the effort kind of stopped um cancer. Um the the overcl classification is is definitely a hurdle for this and our competitors don't necessarily have that like she you know there's no free will in China. She she can just be like hey you're the smartest guy graduating your class you're going to go work for the nation on this you know period and here the problem is no one no one knows it's real. One of the things I hope the film changes is it makes the scientific community know that this is a valid area of inquiry. This is real. It's a real situation and there's a ton of problems for the next generation of engineers and scientists to solve, you know, and so hopefully it inspires them um and helps us make progress because there's a lot of progress that could be made here. Well, it certainly seems like it, but it's like how one of the things that you guys propose in the film that I think maybe the only way forward is some sort of a mass amnesty to all these people that did lie to Congress and probably misappropriated funds and maybe I guess stole them a little bit here and there. Like if you if that doesn't happen, no one is going to push to make this public. No one's going to push for like actual full disclosure because it leaves them too exposed. And if they do have the kind of power that they must have to be running an organization of thousands of people working on something with unbelievable amounts of money being transferred to these programs, they don't want to let that go. Yeah. Like this is like it's a honeypot that they're drawing from, right? And they're probably still taking too much or it's there's no oversight. It's still you're still lying to Congress. And you'd have to you'd have to have some national security amnesty program saying, "Look, it in the interest of national security, it's critically important that we get all of our best people working on this. The only way we're ever going to really do that is to completely reveal that this is actual really this is actually really happening. This is real crafts from somewhere or something. We have them. We'll tell you where we have them. And let's I think right now people wouldn't even freak out because I would think that people would freak out if there was some sort of official narrative of disclosure, but that's sort of been breached, right? The New York Times breached that in 2017. I think this film is that. I mean, there's this is four incredible people saying putting their reputation and name on the line, which which I honestly, Joe, I think it's more it's stronger evidence than any video or photo. These days, you could put a 4K video of a giant craft over Vandenberg and half the human population will say it's AI, right? Or creating some visual effects program, but someone of of of of note putting their name and reputation on the line, their career on the line, the rest of their life's on the line to say this is what I know to be true. To me, that's the greatest evidence that that exists. But I do think to your point, amnesty is something that's going to have to be figured out because while it's hard for anyone to accept letting people off the hook for wrongdoings, right? Um it is it does seem like it's in the best interest of the bigger picture 100% because these people just aren't they have no incentive to come forward with what they've learned. And so to quote Rubio on the film, he says, "Look, this is not a endeavor to go and punish anyone, but we need to know what they learned, right?" And I think he's totally dead on. And you know, is he in favor of some sort of an amnesty program as well? Yeah, he's he says he says on camera in the film, he's like, "I'm not I'm not trying to punish anyone. I need to know what they learned because taxpayers paid for this and it's in our our interest to to know what's going on." But the other thing that's needed is um real whistleblower protection. Not not not the whistleblower protection that's been passed so far, like m much stronger legal protection so that people like, you know, like the folks I talked to, the special forces guys I talked to who were going to come forward and then decided they thought to be forfeiting their lives. You've got to change that set of circumstances. You got to make those people feel like that's not going to happen to them, right? And and and what I think ultimately is going to have to happen, and I wouldn't be surprised, man, if it happens soon after the film comes out. I think a sitting president has to step to the microphone and say definitively, humanity is not alone in the universe. We have recovered technology of non-human origin. So have other nations. There is a high stakes secret cold war race to reverse engine this technology. We need to win this race and the US intends to lead in this new chapter. I think that needs to happen like a level set of basic facts. And I really I really do think it will happen. Well, if that is gonna happen, I think Trump might be the only guy that's willing to do something crazy. I I think I think it's very likely that he does that. I know that I know that he is aware of the film. I know he's aware of what people in his administration say. Has he watched it? Do you know that? He has not watched the film, but I know he's very aware of it. And I know that they are discussing internally how they're going to react to the film publicly. And I also know that he has recently, very recently, tasked Tulsi Gabbert with getting to the bottom of the situation and finding out for him what he needs to know that he doesn't know. Really? Yeah. And as Rubio said in the film, Rubio says on on camera on the record on the film that this has been kept from sitting presidents and he goes into detail on how that's been done and how it's the career bureaucrats at certain in certain elements of the government that control this information and just wait presidents out and don't feel like they have a need to know. Right. Well, there were some people that tried to find information out in the beginning of the Trump administration. Who was it? There was someone that talked about it on record and said he was told at every turn that you don't have the clearance. Yeah. Yeah. But here's the thing. Trump actually found out about the base facts in his last presidency and was contemplating stepping to the microphone. Then what base facts? So Jay Stratton who, you know, ran the task force, he says on camera in my film that he he briefed he that Minutian, the secretary of treasury, asked for a briefing on the lay of the land because Trump asked him to get the briefing and Trump had already known that the base facts that that that we're not alone in the universe that that there's been recovery of crash craft, right? He knew those base facts and he told Minutian that he was thinking about going public. And so Minutian reached out to Stratton to get a briefing and he told he told Stratton that the reason he wanted the briefing is because he needed to be able to evaluate what the impact would be to the economy if the president decided to step to the mic and tell the world we're not alone. Stratton tells the story on camera in the film and I've heard a lot more about it off camera. Uh so we know Trump contemplated doing this already. Now, I think the release of this film and Rubio's involvement puts enough on the table that it it it makes it easier for him to do. I think they would have to have some sort of a plan in place if they were going to say that, right? Like the amnesty plan, the idea behind it would have to be in place if someone or at least grab grab control of the situation and say that we're the this is real and the US intends to lead the way. Because the other the other factor that the White House has to keep in mind is you don't want she or Putin being the guy to do that, right? Don't you don't want them to have that moment, right? Right. Um, you know, something I always think about with when it with regards to that moment of a president stepping to the mic when we entered the space race, Kennedy gave that big famous speech, right? He was like, "We're going to lead in space." Uh, technology like, you know, space technology like nuclear technology has no conscious of its own. and it's up to man to use it for good or bad and we're we're going to make sure it's used for the betterment of all mankind and we're going to lead the way. That was his whole rallying speech, right? And it made the whole scientific community to be like, we're going to help help us win like you know rah rah rah, right? I think that's needed in this race. Like we need all the support of the scientific community of academia, the kids coming out of MIT, we need them putting their brain power towards this and I think the White House knows that. And it's also the greatest. It's the That's the greatest TV moment a leader could have in the history of humanity. Step into the microphone. Do you think Elon knows? Look, I've seen him obviously talk to you about it. I think he knows a lot. Yeah, me too. I don't think you get the contracts and the clearances you need to operate in in space. Yeah. Without some horse trading. Yeah. When I went to SpaceX, I'm like, "Motherfucker, you know everything. There's no way. There's no way you're launching these [ __ ] things into space without them keying you in on exactly what's going on. He's just sly about it. Well, I Well, if they're all aliens, they're certainly all subtle. That's what he says. Like, are they really? I don't know, man. I think it's impossible to operate in space like like he does and not be aware of everything. And and also at the level he he operates clearance-wise. Um, I held a secret screening at the National Space Symposium earlier this year, which is the Super Bowl of the space industry. It's like 60 people, heavy hitters from the space industry. We didn't promote it or publicize it at all, but there were a dozen guys from SpaceX there. And they all and they all seem very aware of everything revealed in the film. Yeah, I'm positive. Yeah, the He's my friend and he won't tell me. He's a legend. He keeps a lid on it. He's a legend. But how did he how would he not know if it is and you know some people have told me he knows that that know he knows some things. So whatever. But the point is people good are good at keeping secrets. That is that's real 100%. Even people that aren't notoriously good at keeping secrets are good at keeping secrets when they have to be. Do you think do you think if if you put yourself you've you've you've interviewed Trump. Do you see him doing that? Stepping to the mic and telling us the truth. someone talks to him about it and convinces him it's a great idea. Like if I had an hour with him, I mean, it's literally the single, in my opinion, the single greatest moment a leader could have. Well, in the history of the world, if he could be the guy that blows the lid off of it, that would definitely help with his legacy, too, which I think would be a good way to convince him, you know, and also that the people would be excited about it. Yeah. You know, it's just I think there's probably a lot of forces that we're not totally aware of that would fight very hard to keep this from being revealed. You know, there's a lot of people whose reputations would probably be in jeopardy. Uh a lot of people that may never get trusted again, even if they get amnesty. We if there's any evidence of impropriy, any evidence of embezzlement, any and which I I can't imagine there's not some [ __ ] funny money flying around here and there and it just no oversight. Come on, guys. Like, oh, you you're above board totally with no oversight at all and a trillion dollars. [ __ ] off. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I do think I've come to understand that he is borderline enraged at how much has been hidden from the White House. So, that alone might motivate him to just step up and and and say the truth. It's also the most bipartisan issue of our time. So, I'll talk to him about it. Have support. Yeah, you can. I'll give it a crack. I'll talk to him about it. There's just there's so many other things to talk about. You get a Nobel Peace Prize for that job. No, I don't want one of those. I'll never show up. Give it to me. can have an empty stage. You know, I think I I really I'm excited to see what happens on the other side of this release because I think it's going to I think it's going to awaken the public. I do think they're going to make a ton of demand on on elected leaders and and representatives to go take this more seriously and it's going to put pressure on the White House. People have never seen someone like Rubio step up and say what he says in the film. You know, the other thing about Rubio, you got to remember he's also the national security adviser and that's never happened in the history of the United States other than Henry Kissinger for two years. This guy's a in a very powerful position, very influential position and aware of a lot more than he was even when he was on the Senate Intelligence Committee as a senator. Interesting. And also motivated and fascinated by it. So he's engaged in the information. Totally. It's what what what what do you find like what do you think if you could choose what happens after a movie like this comes out? What would you like to see? um some mass congressional hearings and a real conversation about amnesty because I think it's the only way to get to the bottom of things because otherwise I think you're going to have every [ __ ] possible legal and uh hierarchal hierarchal whatever the word is hurdle like at every step everyone's going to block your access to information. They're going to lie. They're going to burn records. They're going to hide things. They're not going to tell you where anything is. Yeah. People will get assassinated. They'll be whistleblowers. They'll be in grave danger. I think there's too much money involved. And you you got to think about it like a criminal organization because if you turn them into criminals, they're going to act like criminals. If you if you say, "Hey, you might go to jail for the rest of your [ __ ] life because you lied to Congress and now we know you did." And you know, there's $250 million that your company got and $300 million this company got over the course of x amount of years. And we know we know that you got you're in trouble. like we're gonna put you in jail and then if that if you make them criminals they're going to act like criminals. This I think you're dealing with people that have enormous amounts of money and probably they make weapons. They probably have the most respect for life. It's you know if there's a a real discussion where it makes it look like it's their idea as well. Yeah. That they have this obligation to the American people. They were held under secrecy for so long, but now through this administration and through this openness that we've all decided through the scientific community, we're going to release this [ __ ] No, I think I agree with you. And that could change the world. The other thing to remember is these aren't villains. They're not like this isn't some like dark group of evil people. They're they're they're normal people that were given a job to do and then did it right. And they weren't the decision makers. And and they and they're navigating a situation that is unprecedented. there's no playbook for, right? So, they think they're doing the right thing, right? And and I think that's important to remember, you know. Um, do you know, you know, the put off thing? It was in your documentary with um Bush Senior. He talked about it on the podcast. That is such a fascinating story. Back then, early right after 911. Yeah. Herbert Walker Bush. No, it was Herbert Walker, I believe. No, the panel was The panel was uh it was George Bush Jun. It was W. Oh, I thought it was Bush Senior. Yeah. No, it was right after it was right after 911. Okay, so during that time, so I'm confused. So, but imagine, so let's imagine 2001, where would we be 24 years later if we had real disclosure from the White House? So for people that didn't see the documentary yet or watched the podcast with me and how put off what he said was it was him and a bunch of other thought leaders and they were all brought together with a numerical value for pros and cons related to disclosure. So basically they said to them we have act we we have acquired crafts that are not of this world and we have biological entities that are not of this world. These are real. We want to know if we disclose to the general public that alien life is real, what would be the negative impacts on our society, on our government, on our religion, on economy, every element of society. And they put a numerical value to everything. And overwhelmingly, all the people asked had way more con than pro. Yeah. They determined it was a bad idea. Yeah. which is so wild that there's a think tank bandaid off over a couple days where a a bunch of people got together and decided the fate of humanity. Isn't that fascinating the fate? Well, well, at least I don't think really the fate. I think what it did was just [ __ ] everything. It just slowed the growth of access to this. And I I really give the New York Times a lot of credit because I think publishing in 2017 that that piece that they did on the front page was so huge because the New York Times is arguably the most respected newspaper in the world. And for them to address it like it's a real issue and like these pilots are seeing these things. They're behaving in ways that don't make any sense with propulsion that we do not understand and these are real. Yeah. And this is New York Times. Like that that was so many people texted me after that and called me after that cuz they know that I'm a UFO nut and they're like, "Hey man, this might be real." Like like serious people that I'm friends with. Yeah. And I'm like, I think it's real. I think there's something there. Yeah. And it and it's helped us get us where we are now. I mean, um I don't think the mainstream media support I'm getting from for this film right now, I don't think it would have happened if it wasn't for that article. I think the Times article was the that that burst the membrane and allowed more data to come. It's just more rational discourse about it because I think before then it was just so dismissed and so ridiculed and you just didn't want to be attached to it because you were a fool. You have to be a fool to be considering it. Yeah. But the Times still is one of those legacy media outlets that still hedges their bets. like that article, you know, the original headline, I think, was we're not alone in the universe, and they changed it to, you know, I think it was like black projects and hidden money or something like that. Um, you know, they had to dial it down. Well, because they don't know, right? We might not be alone in the universe. These things might be China's. It's not likely. Well, that's the other thing. If it if we open ourselves to the possibility that these advanced aircraft penetrating our nuclear weapons sites and our military bases are China, that's [ __ ] terrifying. And that should be the biggest issue of our time, hands down because we know the intention of the Chinese Communist Party. It's not good, right? They're not our friends. They're adversaries. And you know, she has made public statements about wanting to replace the United States at the top of the world order. Like it's a stated goal, right? So if it is China, even the possibility that they have some of these crafts alongside non-human crafts existing, right? Yes. Even that possibility, it it it requires the US government to take this so much more serious. Here's an analogy that uh General Jim Clapper made to me. You know, he was the director of national intelligence. He's in the film. He's like, "Before 9/11, we didn't put the right amount of money towards counterterrorism and we weren't properly sharing information in intelligence community. Then this horrible thing happened and the public was outraged and said we got to throw money and resources at counterterrorism. Every representative was beating that drum. We started the director of national intelligence position so that the agencies would all share information and you you would minimize the chance of uh intelligence gaps, right? And we threw tons of appropriated funds towards counterterrorism. we now spend more money on counterterrorism than we even need to. And his point was he hopes it doesn't take something bad happening on this front like China cracking this technology in a way we haven't and then using it against us or non-human intelligent life taking an action that isn't favorable to us uh before we then throw resources towards it. And it's essentially the same thing Rubio said. They they think we need to get ahead of this problem, not wait for it to happen and then react to it. Well, of course. I mean, it would be a horrible loss both in terms of our our our our national pride of being the innovators and being at the head of technology. If if China came out and said, "We've cracked this. We have UFOs that we backgineered and now we can fly them around and we can go visit other solar systems and we've created a new energy source. We're going to save the planet." Yeah. We would be we would look like fools. Yeah. And if we realized that there would have been a bunch of people that were working on this stuff the whole time, but they had been handcuffed by all the secrecy and that this had all been done with defense contractors and lying to Congress, it'd be a [ __ ] national disaster. It would we would look completely incompetent. I really legitimately think a lot of the people in my film stepped up because they don't want to be left hole in the bag and have people saying, "Why didn't you say something sooner?" I really think this is that cover your butt cuz it's that close. So when people talk about the successful back engineering of these things, what are they saying? Are they saying that they can fly around Earth? Are they saying they can go outside of Earth's atmosphere and go into deep space with these things? It's like what what have they said we are currently able to do with these back engineered crafts that we've supposedly people that I can't attribute the statement to that were very credible sources told me that some of the UA UAP activity in space specifically is reverse engineered technology. Okay. Does that mean in space in low Earth orbit or does that mean traveling through the solar system? the what was implied to me was traveling through the solar system. Geez. Yeah. So are these here's another thing someone that that same person said to me by the way. Yes. So before I forget that their belief is that the technology we have would not be pulled out even to stop a world war. It would not those cards would not be shown until moments before like a nuclear war situation. So they wouldn't pull it out to stop like any of the wars we've experienced in the last, you know, since World War II. Um they wouldn't, you know, regardless of how many It has to get to nine. It has to get to a level where there's no Yeah. There's no other option. Wow. Cuz it show your cards. Now, when they say that they've traveled through the solar system, is this biological human beings or are these drone crafts? Like, what are they saying? I I I never got any of that. I never got any of that. All I was told is there's some of the some of the UAPs that are seen that have been seen by our astronauts on space missions are non-human intelligent life and some are reverse engineered craft. That's what I was told. But we don't know whether there's a person inside of them. I I don't If they are reverse engineered and they are ours and we figured out how to make our own that I don't know. Yeah, I need to know that. Yeah, that's kind of important. Is there [ __ ] some dude named Bob flying through space? Some Top Gun guy that they've given the task of traveling to Venus real quick? Wouldn't surprise me. You know, one of the other things that, you know, we were talking about Clapper and Ruby and what they said about China. something else that they both said despite these guys being completely ideologically opposed, right? Like they have no nothing else in common. Um they both spoke to how we as a species, not just our country, but an entire human species is held back by this. There's something the fact that there's something in the human psyche that says I can't prepare for or wrap my head around something I haven't experienced yet. Right? And how that leads to strategic surprise because you're not preparing for something that can ultimately end up happening. And Rubio makes great examples. He says, you know, we didn't think the Japanese could torpedo us at Pearl Harbor till they figured it out. And they did, right? We didn't think that terrorists were going to come here and learn how to fly commercial airplanes and use them in a terror attack until they did. And with this, he's like, we don't want strategic surprise to lead to a disaster on this front. We need to be ahead of it. And he very powerfully says, you know, often strategic surprise changes the course of human history. So this is the question. If we have craft that we can travel through the solar we meaning someone in the United States of America does China do they have the same ability right now? Is there an understanding of where they're at in the race versus us? Everyone who talked about the race with China was extremely concerned about how close they were. And multiple people talked about how these incursions over our sensitive bases and nukes could in fact be reverse engineered Chinese craft. So it is it is a scary situation. I mean look, you can ask the average person a common sense question knowing what you know about the dynamic between China and the United States. Would you be okay if they were the only country that had a nuclear weapon? The answer is no. Right. Right. So, would you want them to be the only country that has technology more powerful than a nuclear weapon that could be weaponized in a way that's more destructive than a nuclear weapon? No. But what technology do they have other than the ability to travel? What other observed technology do they have? Do you Well, if you weaponize this technology, like let's just take something like the Tic Tac. Imagine you could imagine you could travel anywhere in the world and put a nuclear weapon in there, right? You would instant you would have a nuclear weapon that goes off in less than a second on the other side of the world. It's completely undetectable to any sensor system. You can't react to it. Yeah. You know, bad news. It also these these vehicles display the ability to be transmedium. So you could put a nuke through any environment. It's very scary. Well, so transmedium does that mean I know that it can go in the air and in the water, but does that mean it can go through actual physical objects? Yeah. So, this is one of the things in one of the crazier Jacqu Valet stories that uh I've read a few of his books and one of the more bizarre ones. This woman found this object in uh on her property, some large property, I want to say it's Nevada. I forget where it was. California, Nevada, but anyway, this in this eggshaped large object and that as it took off, it flew through the trees. Yeah. She said it didn't disturb the trees, it just went right through them. Yeah. So that's I mean look one of those one of those the if you remember in the film there's this great scene where Hal Pudof and Eric Davis were two of the senior scientists involved with the government UAP programs. They break down how they figured out how these craft work and how they are warping spaceime in a localized area and they're basically creating a bubble that the craft operates in. And the bubble separates the craft from the environment around it. The environment becomes irrelevant. So can move through physical space, could move from air to space to the water, frictionless, there's no splash. Like the environment outside the bubble is irrelevant. They're they're creating their own space time. Essentially, they're warping space time and creating a bubble around the craft. And when you start to think about how that could be weaponized, it's really terrifying. And what is he saying that they're using? Like how are they He's saying that they're creating an immense amount of energy in this localized area to create the bubble. And there's two prevailing thoughts on how that energy is created. One is they're tapping into so-called zero point energy, which has only been theorized at this point by humans, right? Um or they're using quantum entanglement to pull energy from a far-off source to the local area, the the bubble. And that's what they figured out. And do they have any knowledge of these generators or how they're acquiring this amount of power? or what they're using to how are they harnessing 0 point energy? No, no, no. But if we've got one and we've backged it successfully, clearly someone must know. Yeah. So, someone knows. Look, Hal and Eric got very close with the scientists on the legacy program and we're sharing information and that got shut down by the CIA. So before it got shut down, they learned a lot about what we've been doing secretly and what we've been figuring out. Jeez. So it's the [ __ ] CIA. Well, look, the film the film the film reveals that the uh the legacy program, the craft retrieval reverse engineering program, it has several elements. It's elements of the Air Force. It's elements of the Department of Energy. It's elements of the CIA and its defense contractors. And the CIA is the quarterback of the whole thing. The Air Force is used for recovery like field work essentially. They have the teams that can you know react fast and go to a site and collect materials and classify it and they have the aircraft to bring it back to a base. The defense contractors have the technology knowhow and the engineering skills to do the reverse engineering. The Department of Energy has laws that can be used to classify the material outside of you know the president's reach and congress's reach. They also have, you know, people who are experts at anything that gives off a lot of radiation and energy. Um, and then the um, the CIA quarterbacks the whole thing. Think of them as like operational control. And this is revealed by a number of people in the film and um, every single source I talked to. There were a lot of people, Joe, that I talked to in very senior positions that thought the film was important and the only way to bring the truth out to the public, but they couldn't be on camera and they guided me, you know, filled in gaps for me, helped me understand the lay of the land. There were some people that told me not to interview. There was a couple mole there was a couple people that were sent to me. I was people wanted to trick me into including them in the film really because they were crazy people. Um, and I didn't I didn't I didn't I didn't include them. I got tipped off by people. Don't stay clear of that. that's someone's agenda trying to sink your ship, right? Um but uh yeah, I had a lot of folks helping. The Senate Intelligence Committee and the Senate Armed Services Committee were extremely supportive and you know, I really don't think I would have been able to pull off making the film I did if not for their their help. And Rubio when I started my process was the vice chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee. and he had already learned a lot about what has been hidden from Congress and thought that what I was doing was really the only way to bring it out because none of these none of these people on their own would go out on a limb by themselves and become subject to ridicule. They didn't want to be the one guy out there saying all this extraordinary stuff, right? not only because there there's this antiquated cultural stigma where they could be made fun of or the reputation can be damaged, but there's also this security system around the deeply hidden craft field program that for years has just targeted anyone who speaks up. And so what I basically put together was a way for them to safely do it and have strength in numbers and be arm-in- arm with, you know, several dozen other people. And once Rubio leaned into that, I just started getting tremendous support from the armed service committee and the intelligence committee and then Senator Rounds became very helpful behind the scenes. Um, intelligence officials um who worked this topic like like J Stratton and Lu Alzando and Hal Pudof um were extremely helpful behind the scenes opening doors, introducing me to people. Um and uh yeah, I think that um I think this is really the only way this is this we were gonna we were going to get this level of information out by giving people that safety and numbers and then after this it's going to require the the kind of amnesty we talked about because this is only what they can lawfully disclose. There's so much more. So, when it comes to underground or excuse me, underwater stuff, um, this is what Tim Buret was talking about when those that person was famously interviewing him and everybody was like, "What? You're just walking across the street casually talking about bases?" Yeah. Where they're coming out of the ocean? Yeah. What do they think that is? Do is that different from what's going on in the sky or No, they think it's the same They think it's the same crafts. They think So, they have a base. More simply put, if you were here with advanced aircraft and you wanted to hide from humanity, the most logical place is the ocean. It's the majority of our planet. We've barely we've barely studied it. We've barely we've we've uh one of the admirals in my film says we've scanned the surface of the moon in more detail than we have the bottom of our oceans. Yeah. It's crazy how much is unexplored. Right. Right. And so it's the most obvious place to hide. There's a lot of activity that happens in the oceans. Um, one of the one of the one of the people I talked to who thought they would be in the film and then decided it was too risky for them was a special forces guy who was involved in a recovery of a craft that was in the ocean. And when they were recovering it, a giant craft came up next to them, like a functioning craft. And the helicopter pulled out and they dropped the line and the helicopter took off and the seal was in the water and watched this thing take off and then he had to be recovered out of the water and that's crazy. And the craft that they were trying to recover went down and did the the big ship take it or anything or They said actually they actually literally said that they said it took it and went back down. Yo. Yeah. How big was the big one? They said it was big. Just big. That's the only word they used to be honest. Yeah. And the guy was rattled cuz the guy was in the water the seal was in the water hooking a line to this craft. And then when the helicopter pulled out he said he was in the water just [ __ ] his pants and taking in this extraordinary experience. And then um was he wearing a vest? I'm I'm sure he's wearing he's like doggy paddling. Leave him there in the [ __ ] water. These guys panic and pull out. Maybe the UFO would have let you take it. All these all these situations are really bonkers. Um I wonder what would happen if they were like, "Fuck you. We're taking it." You know, I I I I what I often wonder is if any of the guys on that chopper snap snap video of this thing. You know, there's a lot of video that exists that is either classified at a crazy high level or people are just terrified to share, you know. Um, and that's one of the other things like once we need we need we need a declassification process that's real and sincere and you know rigorously goes through what's there and what can be showed that won't hurt our national security. Right. Right. And just start being transparent with with the public. Um, this this encounter of uh the SEAL reminded me of another thing that I think is really important and speaks to the accountability issue. There's a number of military personnel and scientists that have worked for defense contractors who have had and intelligence officials who have had encounters and then end up with biological effects like real issues, cancer, immune, you know, um uh um autoimmune issues. Um a number of people have died of cancer after being around these things. And that's a whole another level of accountability. You know, there's there's people whose medical bills should have been paid for. They shouldn't have been put in those situations. You know, there's families growing up without a dad because dad encountered a UFO on behalf of the US government and died. Jesus. So, that's that's a whole So, is this other side of this them getting cancer from being around the object or being around biologics or both? the the object cuz these object because once you understand that these craft are warping space time in a localized area and creating immense amount of energy getting close to it's like getting close to a you know a huge electrical system or you know it's just it's bad right you know that's the Travis Walton story it's a lot of stories yeah well that Travis Walton in particular that's what you know he said happened he got close to the object and something zapped him and you know whether it was an actual like targeted attack or whether it was just something a reaction to him being so close to this energy that he was thrown back, knocked unconscious, gravely hurt. Yeah. And that they took off. Yeah. I've I've spoken I've spoken off the record to some intel officials who have managed to actually get the government to take accountability and give them anonymous health injury status, AHI status, which has only gone to um victims of quote unquote Havana syndrome. Um, and it's it's a real situation, but not everyone has the relationships or the ability to get escalated to the Secretary of Defense and get that AHI status. The Secretary of Defense has to give you the AHI status. This is going to sound crazy, but is there a particular protocol for dealing with the kind of cancer that you get from getting in contact with a UFO? The only thing that I know of, I wouldn't call it a protocol, but I do know that there is um a couple specific people, doctors who have become a part of the intelligence communities looking into this and they've become the go-to doctors for people having biological effects. Then they if you have a relationship with them, if you can get to them, they show up pretty quickly and do the appropriate tests and documentation of it and have the right doctors to send you to. Um Gary Nolan, who you interviewed, is one of those people. Yeah. Gary Nolan, who's done some groundbreaking research on cancer. Yeah. Um Gary, the other the other guy uh I shouldn't say his name, but um he used to work for he used to work for um one of the big intelligence agencies that's deeply involved in this. The other thing that Gary has that's really fascinating is the research on materials, like some of the some of the allegedly retrieved materials from crash sites and how bizarre they are. Yeah. From studying the isotopes. the the the stuff that Gary's gotten into that I find the most mind-blowing is he has real classified documentation of encounters that military and intelligence officials have had with UAP and biological effects it's caused. And some of them are crazy, like a Department of Defense official who had a UAP above his house and went out in his backyard and looked up at it and then the thing zapped him with the directed energy weapon. And he has all of the medical signs of a directed energy attack. And this is a super senior, credible guy who had recently been made aware of the UAP issue and then he has this experience. Wow. Yeah, it's pretty wild. Um, so what are the effects of a direct energy weapon? Like what's the what are the consequences? Cancer. That's what he's getting. Cancer. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Do you know about the Varia Brazil story? Do you know about the James Fox documentary? James I'm excited to see James' um follow. Yeah, he's got a new one. Yeah, he's got a followup with I think it's the actual doctor. Yeah. That worked with the patient. So he was at the hospital that night and interacted with with the being. Yeah, I'm excited to see that. So the story is that this police officer that they found this crash and the documentary is excellent. If you haven't seen that, folks, it's called Moment of Contact. It's really good. And one of the things that's really good about it is the eyewitnesses. When the eyewitnesses return to the scene of the crime, I'm like or excuse me, the scene of the crash. I was like, either that guy is an amazing actor. No, it's great. or he's really crying because he's remembering this insane moment in his life. Yeah. And there was eyewitnesses that saw a live one of these things and this police officer found one that was injured, carried it, put it in the car, physically carried it. They brought it to a hospital. That hospital told them, "We don't know what to do with this. You got to take it somewhere else." They took it to a second hospital. And the second hospital, this is the doctor allegedly that examined it. Yeah. that police officer had a horrific bacterial infection that they could not cure and he died within weeks. It's horrible. Yeah, it's horrible. There's there's so many examples of these interactions going bad. But it's also like, you know, imagine you didn't know what a fighter jet was and there was, you know, giant flame coming out of the back of it and you walk behind it, you're going to be toast. You know, it it's not I don't think it's an intentional thing. I think it's we're interacting with a technology we don't understand and and you're getting too close to it. We're getting too close to it. Don't go walk up to it. If it's floating in the airt means it's got an insane amount of power that's carrying this [ __ ] totally 2,000 ton thing. The other crazy story that um was in so um James Fox's movie The Phenomenon, which uh you know, he directed it. Yeah. He's totally responsible for make that movie. I was a producer on it with him. Um but it's all James. James 100% made that movie. Um, one of the coolest stories in that film was the aerial school phenomenon story at the end. These kids in Zimbabwe at a school in like I think it was 89 or 90 91 something like that. Maybe it was 94 around that time. Um, these kids like between the ages of like seven and 13 or something like that. Um, they all saw this this craft come down during their recess and they all say they experienced the same thing. And they all saw these beings um that looked like they were moving in slow motion around the craft and they saw this craft take off at thousands of miles an hour after. Years later, they're all saying the same thing. The stories didn't change. They didn't try to like, you know, make money off this at all. Um it's a wild story. But now when you look back at that story through what guys like Hal and Eric are revealing about the warp bubble, do you know what would make someone look like they're moving slow if they were inside of a warp bubble next to the craft where time and space is moving differently than outside the craft. That's literally what it would do for the same reasons why the craft could in the bubble could just be cruising along but to us it looks like it's going at these impossible speeds. It you're in a different space-time environment. So all these things that people saw at Ariel, you know, in Brazil, they get des they get explained by these reveals that are starting to come out now. And that's to me that's wild seeing how these things all connect, you know. Yeah, it is crazy. And it's essentially this description of the way these propulsion systems work is essentially the exact same way Lazar was describing it. Yeah. which is really nuts that in 1989 he was proposing that there's some sort of a gravitydefying device. Yeah. And that it was using element 115 and then it was radiated and somehow another is creating this gravity drive that just sends it to wherever it wants to be rather than propels it. Yeah. That it the way he described it is like if you took a bowling ball and you put it in a very soft cushion, it would just push through. And that that's what these things do. It just pushes through to wherever it's supposed to be. Yeah. Similar similar the other the other explanation is like um like a like a ball rolling downhill like a like a surfboard pointed down riding a wave. When did they first start to become aware of underwater activity and when did they first start to suspect that these things were in fact having at least some sort of a base underneath the oceans? I don't know the exact first, but I do know from people I've talked to that as far back as the 80s. Wow. Yeah. Which is incredible. Well, the crazy thing is that if they they've really been studying this stuff and retrieving things like back from Roswell, which was 47, they've really been doing this stuff for that long. It's it's kind of crazy that they were able to actually keep a lid on it for for so long. I mean, it's not that crazy when your life's being threatened, you know, like and it's kind of got a lid on it, right? Kind of. But not really. I mean, there's been all about Roswell. Yeah, there's been people leaking over the years information, but I think now we're at a tipping point where like I really believe the release of this film is the singular tipping point where you have this many credible highle people saying yes, this is real. I mean, even Clapper talking going on the record saying that UAP activity over Area 51 is real. the biggest conspiracy globally that there's UFOs over Area 51 that 90% of humanity has written off as [ __ ] Right. Right. Here's the guy who was director of national intelligence and head of air force intelligence saying no that's real. Like it's like so I think this tipping point and Rubio going on the record, second most powerful guy in the world arguably saying that the presidents are kept out of the loop on this and that defense contractors have taken this over and that even he even says that every now and then advancements made get slipped into commercialized product that some defense contractors make a bunch of money on for their own best interest, not for the benefit of the nation and national security. Like these are bombs dropped at the most credible level possible. I think that because we've had all the leaks over the years, it's going to resonate with people. People are like, "Oh [ __ ] all those things that have been slipping out over the years, it's real and these guys are validating it." And it'll be really interesting to see what's, you know, what's on the other side of that. And the other wild thing, Joe, is when you go down the rabbit hole of the UAP topic with people in intelligence committee, military, you start learning about adjacent things, you know, that are equally bonkers like remote viewing, which you've talked a lot about, right? You know, I mean, I don't think it's a coincidence that Hal Budaf, you know, was the guy who created Stargate and ran Stargate, backed by the DoD and the CIA and also was deeply involved in the UAP topic for decades. You know, um there's a lot of overlap and the remote viewing topic is fascinating. It's another one of those things where you more you learn about it, you're like, there is a there there. It's a real situation and it's extraordinary. Yeah. Makes you think how much more is, you know, hidden from us that we have. I definitely want to talk about that, but I want to ask you, were there specifics when they talk about technology that was acquired that was then rolled into No, no one no one no one said it on the record. I was I was shocked when when Rubio said that on camera when he went there like clearly clearly clearly stating that I mean I think to word for word I think he says uh and every now and then an advancement gets made and gets commercialized and some companies making a ton of money on it for their own interest. Is there any suspicions when you Yeah. No, I've heard I've heard I've heard suspicions like you know how it could has impacted uh hypersonic missiles. I've heard things about you know early days of fiber optics. I've heard things about night vision. Um but you know no one no one would go on the record and say something definitive. The the thing people were comfortable saying and Rubia said is that defense contractors have been in control of this over the decades. Congressional oversight has Cong Congress has lost congressional oversight and essentially these programs are just moving moving along and keeping it to themselves. And when you're keeping something to yourself, it's easy to slip a win into your commercialized side of your business, you know? Right. I would like to know what that is, though. That would be really interesting. Do you know the the And who knows, by the way, if it's even public, it might be something that they made, right, that isn't public that they're using to get bigger contracts. Right. Right. in exchange for shutting up about it. Right. Of course. Why wouldn't you? Let's go deep. Put that [ __ ] chin tinfoil hat on securely. Um do you know about the conspiracy about Bell Laboratory in New Jersey? Yeah, I've heard I've heard I've heard a lot about that. You you got um the the tinfoil hat thing is a good reminder that has been you that the one of the things I learned is that the stigma around this was created by the people covering this up. So Oh yeah. In the early 50s, late 40s, the CIA when they took control of this, they were like, "We got to make sure people don't ask about this. How do we do that?" It's just psych psychological operation. Like, make people think they're crazy. Make people think they're a wacko. Make tinfoil hat jokes. And then that gets, you know, built into our culture and different generations grow up thinking, "Oh, you're a nut if you talk about this. It' be embarrassing. You're going to have your career ruined." And now here we are where like, you know, people giggle when you bring up this serious issue. Right. And and still Yeah. and it's been used against people inside a government. So here's here's a good story. This is uh yeah, I'll I'll just tell you. So So Jay J Stratton told me about an event that happened on the military base that is Top Gun, the Top Gun base where a craft came down. I don't know the exact how high exactly how high it was, whether it was in the air or in space, but came down from very high, dropped to above the tarmac in front of the base commander and his number two. and they documented it with video recording. And this was when Jay was running the UAP task force and they reached out to him and saying they wanted to report this. And Jay went Jay went and talked to them in person. And they were going to do an these are super senior guys that were going to do an official on there um testimony about what they saw with their own eyes. And Jay told a senior guy in naval intelligence who he thought was on the right side of history. And before these guys could come in and testify, the naval intelligence official who was actually part of the cover up sent these guys tinfoil hats and told them that's what they'd be wearing the rest of their lives if they spoke up. Wow. And the guys reached out to Jay and said, "We're not providing the evidence. We're not going to talk about this. Let's pretend it never happened." So, you know, that kind of stuff really holds back because it's very easy to deter a military somebody who's put their devoted their whole life to the to climbing the ladder in a in the military. Yeah. And you're going to tell them that you could just end their career path in an instant. Why would they keep going forward? Yeah. Why would they? Makes no sense. I wouldn't. I'd shut my [ __ ] mouth and maybe tell Jesse Michaels 10 years later. That's that's what a lot of these guys wind up doing. They retire and then they start talking. I do think that we're going to see more people come out. I really I've already started I've I've started receiving since the trailers have been out there. I've started receiving incoming DMs on social media sites um from super senior people where like I look up who they are and I'm like, "Holy shit." You know, and they're like, "Hey, we should talk in person sometime. There's some things I want to share." Whoa. And I don't know what's going to come out of that. I haven't uh I haven't done those those those meetings yet, but I imagine people are going to come out of the woodwork because this stuff is real and it's been hidden so much. Um and I know there's some big people coming out next year. Um Stratton's book is going to be a big thing, too. I've I've I've actually I've been I've been working with him on it, developing his book, and it's going to come out in the spring. Harper Collins is publishing it, and it's it's [ __ ] bombshell. It's bonkers. Wow. So much detail. One of the other things that I didn't include in the film, Joe, that's I mean it's it's it's bonkers to think about all of the intelligence officials who actually investigated this for the government. Like the people involved in OAP and ATIP and UAP task force, they all started having activity at their homes when they were investigating non-human intelligent life. What kind of activity? orbs in their houses, orbs interacting with their family, causing medical issues for family members, ending up in the family members ending up in the hospital due to orb activity. Like, but what what issues due to or orb activity? Um, one of the senior intelligence officials that I spoke to, and I'll let him tell his own story um when he's ready, but uh uh son got extremely impacted by an orb, black and blue over his whole body. Had to go to the hospital. looked looked like someone took a bat to his chest. Um, I didn't include this in the film um this section because I feel like when you get into the stuff happening people's houses, I think it's a bridge too far for a lot of people and you got to like set the table with the base facts first, which is what my film does and then they can open their minds to these other things. But um what I found really interesting is when I would do these interviews with people and they would all talk about this activity they started having at their houses that in some cases caused medical issues. Um it was all after they started looking into non-human intelligent life. And their takeaway was that non-human intelligent life was looking into them because they were looking into non-human intelligent life. And they made the analogy of if a Russian spy comes to DC to spy on Congress, our intelligence community spies on the Russian spy. And so that was their outlook. And I thought that was was really interesting and uh almost implies like a a human level of thinking, you know, right? Or maybe some attempt to make contact. Yeah. You know, there was a guy that I interviewed at Skinwalker Ranch who lived uh outside of the ranch who had an orb experience and uh I talked to a few people there that were clearly out of their [ __ ] mind and maybe on meth, but a few people uh that seemed pretty credible. And this guy was the most just a regular guy with a regular job. Interesting guy, cool to talk to. Um, he said that he's had a few weird sightings, but the the weirdest one was one day in his home. this orb that was like uh larger than a softball, he said, but came flying into his house and was in the living room with him and it was interacting with him and then it flew down the hallway and flew right through the walls and disappeared. But he said it interacted with him like it was in front of him like letting him know that it's there almost in some people say almost in a playful way. Yeah. Oh, and I've heard about this orb of activity in intelligence officials houses like more times than I can remember. Countless times. And the journey of this movie, I not only got to know a lot of these intelligence officials very well, but like went and spent time with their wives, with their kids, with them together. And when you see like a wife completing a husband's sentence, like they're telling you what they experienced together, it's bonkers, man. It's wild. It's like, holy [ __ ] this happened, you know? And then when you when you hear their kids talk about it separately and you're like that's literally word for word what like you guys are all experienced the same thing. You have these different POVs. It's not like the family got together with a coordinated lie. Doesn't feel like the kids into doing it. That seems little that seems a little over the top cuz like to what end, right? I didn't it's not like I put it in the movie, you know. Um um yeah, but it's it's it's really fascinating. And the orb activity um who knows what it is, man. could be it could be another form of the warping of space time in a localized area like once you do that time and space is different in that bubble. So that could be a a much bigger craft inside of a energy ball that we see. We might just might be what we see is the orb, right? It might be a transportation device. There might be a being in there and this is just what we're seeing is what's on the outside of this warping of spaceime. Well, that's another thing that one of the eyewitnesses described that was very weird was a a craft that was small, but then when they got inside of it, it was the size of a football field. Yeah. So, that that also goes with the warping of space time. So, Pal says in the film, this was something I was shocked that Al said, I was really shocked. He says the warping of space time in the bubble explains a lot of things that at this point haven't made sense to us. And he says like for example when a military uh serviceman goes onto a craft that looks like it's you know 40 feet and then when he goes inside it looks like it's the size of a football field. That makes sense now because from outside the bubble it's one thing and inside the bubble it's something else. Right. And um that's wild. Yeah. And I've heard that story a number of times from people who have never talked to each other. Yeah. It's like we have this very simple understanding of objects and of space and the ability to move around in them and this kind of spectacular technology. I think we kind of have to think about it just like all other spectacular technology like you if you were around in the 1400s you couldn't possibly imagine the concept of a nuclear bomb. It would be impossible or nuclear energy or even a cell phone. Yeah. Now imagine new breakthroughs happen and now this bubble gets created and we start to figure out how to send things two places through these bubbles and then we realize that what's happening in these bubbles is not what you see on the outside that it's completely warping which is also one of the weird questions like why are UFOs so blurry? Well, that answers that question because you know how says it and how says it and I and I loved when he revealed this because like a just checks the box makes sense. People have trouble taking photos of UAP because they're literally taking a photo through a space war a space-time bubble basically the warping of space time. So the analogy would be like you know if you go under the ocean, you take a picture of a fish, you're going to get better visibility. You're in their domain, right? You're in their environment, right? But if you go above the ocean, right? you're now in a different environment and you try taking a photo from above the water, it's going to be all distorted and wacky looking because you're taking a photo through a barrier, another environment, right? It's the same basic logic. Like try taking a picture of koish from above the water. You can't do it, right? Uh and so that's just the simplest answer. Like that's what they're doing. They are warping spaceime in a localized area. They're creating a barrier between our environment and their environment. And when you try to take a photo through it, it's not great. Also the reason why radar has trouble getting these things because the radar detector, a radar detector, the way it works is radar is emitted towards an object. It bounces back to the radar detector and that's how you track where it is, right? But the radar is just going around the bubble and it's not going back to the radar detector because it's just going around the bubble. Yeah, it's a different environment, right? And supposedly we can do that now. Well, the interview subjects clearly imply that some of the UA not imply, they state that some of the UAP we're seeing might be our reverse engineer technology might be. And is there is there any theories about other potential methods of propulsion rather than just this bubble? Is anything done in a more traditional way? Are there like is there levels of these things like when it comes to the technological abilities? there. Everyone I interviewed that was willing to talk about the technology was convinced this is what they were doing that they were all doing and it was a unifying and it was a unifying theory. It explains everything we've ever observed like all the the the all the performance characteristics we've observed UAP displaying. And so the theory is that all of these advanced beings from wherever they're from, the various different species of them that all of them have this particular type of technology. Yeah. Huh. Which if it's the key to interstellar travel, then kind of makes sense. But it's like, are they all figuring out this? Are they getting it from each other? Like, is this just a natural pathway to curious, intelligent, innovative creatures that they ultimately eventually stumble upon this technology? Well, one of the one of the things shared in the shared I I found fascinating was this idea that some of the craft that we've recovered and adversarial nations have recovered weren't crash crafts and weren't crafts that they caused a crash. They were crafts that just appeared outside a military base almost like a gift. Yeah, Diana Basula discusses them as donations. So gifts, donations, but the the the thought if you if you Okay, so if you try to explain that, why would anyone do that? Maybe some more advanced species is trying to help advance us and try to like put a carrot on a stick. Yeah. Maybe it's, you know, survival of the fittest for the nations of of of Earth. You know, maybe it's a big IQ test. Who knows what it is, but that's an interesting scenario and and seems intentional from whoever put it there. Well, it would make sense if they were trying to help that. That would be like the least intrusive way instead of like coming down, hello, let me show you how to do this. Instead of doing that, just like, hey, figure this out, stupid. Get all your brightest people. And at the very least, you'll figure something out. Yeah. And maybe that's what they're saying that these things have gone into some sort of a commercial application that they figure. I just want to know what those things are because this was the thing that I was getting at with Bell Laboratory. So, Bell uh Bell Labs was this is the the conspiracy theory is that some of the material that was retrieved from Roswell was then transported to Bell Labs for some sort of a back engineering program and that there was a reason why there was a military base right outside of Bell Labs. And the idea was that military base is supposed to be guarding New York City, but the New York City was like kind of far away. Like you'd want to be a little closer if you're guarding New York City. And it's much more likely that it was actually just guarding this laboratory. And that um there was a company called the American Computer Company. And the American Computer Company, are they still around? Um see if they still have this page. It's a very wacky page. Um so they would just made uh they made made to order computers. Like you would call it up. I want a, you know, whatever 5 gigahertz Intel processor, blah, blah, blah. And they would do it all for you. I want a two terbyte hard drive. They would, they would set it all up for you and send it to you. And then they had a whole section of their website that was dedicated to back engineering technology from Bell Labs and how it all happened. And they were talking about the the invention of fiber optics and also the transistor that these things had come specifically from the discoveries that they had made from the back engineering of a craft that was down at Roswell. Yeah. Um which was also by the way Roswell was a site of a lot of nuclear testing. Yeah. I was told that ro you know people say in the film that Roswell did in fact happen. There was a crash. Four non-human bodies were in the craft and recovered and the technology the craft materials and the bodies were sent to Wright Pat Air Force Base right in Ohio which is very close to Battel right and um and um and then maybe that's the reason why Bellabs is near a military base. Maybe it's more about proximity to a base that can have recovery teams quickly deployed, come back with materials, and then get them to a facility close by without the need for, you know, moving them across the country. And that would also, if it was true, would also be one of the first examples of this coordination between government and defense contractors, government and scientists that were commercially working. Yeah. and that they somehow or another arranged to get these brightest minds to hey, what's this? How's this work? Is that computer company still around? I don't think so, but I just stumbled across something I was reading that I another story about the Bell Lab story. It's like a letter letter from the guy that says he's the head of American computer company. What does he say? I I just I just found it as you asked the question trying to see why this was relevant. This was like back I want to say it might have been like the '9s, late 90s or early 2000s when I first started going online and I found out about them because you know I used to make my own computers back then. So I would go and get a motherboard and hard drive and do all that stuff. That's cool. It was fun for gaming. It was really fun because you could like set it up with like powerful video cards and everything like that. Um but there was a bunch of companies that would sell like really high-end put together computers so you didn't have to go through all that work. And uh so I was just looking at companies that make computers made to order Windows computers and I found them and I was like what what the [ __ ] is this? Do they still have that up? That's wild. I that I don't know. I started to try to find it. I thought I found it. What about uh the Wayback Machine? Well, this article that I found that says it's extracted from Nexus magazine 1999. You know the thing about when you think about engineer. Hold on. What does it say? He says everything you talked about. It's I'll show you just a very It's very long. This is super long. It's all written, but it it talks about right there. Alien craft. Yeah. Okay. So it said, "So now, not only do we have a picture of the alleged alien craft on our website talking about alien technologies being transferred to at AT&T, but we're also in possession of a very highlevel level five top secret security clearance military fax is describing something called Sky Station." What? Here it says like we try to be cute. We try to put up a picture. If you go to our website, it's still there. Here's our website. Bottom of the page is a navbar pointer. Is that website still up? I'll click out. Click on Let's see what we got here. Just in case I'm weird. Yeah. Nope. That probably is not the exact That's gone, son. It's a website. Yeah, but that's a [ __ ] website. That's not the American computer company website, is it? No, that's just like American Priority Payment Systems. What is this? Who bought them? Do you know? Probably the [ __ ] government, man. But it this is talking about everything you just said. But although that's why I was trying to figure out where what what this is. It's uh websites here. I don't know. Reverse engineering Roswell UFO technology that came. Look at this. It says here the symbol for the transistor is made up of three pieces positive, positive and negative or negative, negative and positive. Silicon dioxide doped with arsenic and boron in 1947. Now 1947 doping things with boron was not easy. It required the sort of equipment that even Bell Labs in 1946 did not possess. They they had this type of equipment at Lawrence Berkeley Laboratories, but it would have taken thousands and thousands and thousands of man-hour to invent the transistor. If you look back at it historically, what AT&T was claiming was that one day this genius William Shockley working uh with a rectifier. He locked looked at it and noticed that it had unusual propensities and there bingo he invented the transistor. He figured it out right there. And to verify that, the two other geniuses that they got to help work with him on the transistor, Dr. Bonan and Dr. Bratton Brat Bratain Bratain uh both said, "Oh yeah, I remember the guy by his name by the name of the case was allegedly talking about transistors in 1931 and I knew back then we were going to have them said that that is the history of the transistor at AT&T prior to 1948 other than claiming it was invented in December of 1947 by Dr. Shockley." Anybody believe that story? Me neither. And I knew because the administrative head of the Transistor project was Jack Morton, the man uh at whose house I was staying to go to school and whose sons I was friends with. And he often commented on the fact that it was really a shame that those three idiots got responsibility for the transistor and he didn't. And I always wondered because he too didn't possess the scientific ability to develop the transistor. He was a brilliant man who had invented uh the radio broadcast vacuum tube, the closed spaced triode. But it appeared that he was brought in to head up the project to try to draw back the transistor in time to radio tubes. And the image that shockly shockley talked about and it was as if the whole thing was just a ploy and he might as easily have been given responsibility and gotten the Nobel Prize as Bill Shockley. Professional jealousy it says question mark. Wow. Yeah. So there's questions about the invention of the transistor according to these guys. But it's also fiber optics and it's the the things that what they're saying is that these things kind of came out of nowhere. Came out of nowhere. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's hard not to line it up, you know. Yeah. And well, it certainly lines up timewise. Yeah. With the Roswell crash and and and you know, the labs working on these things being close proximity to bases that are known for recoveries and reverse engineering like around Roswell, the the engineers, the Army Airore engineers that were based at Right Pat were literally the expert reverse engineers of the Army Airore. Like that's that's who was based there. That's so crazy. Yeah. And people people forget at the time it was the Army Airore at Roswell, you know. Yeah. Um and the uh Yeah. I mean the the dots all line up, you know. The other thing to think about with with what technology has been cracked is just because we haven't seen it yet doesn't mean they didn't crack it. Like typically, you know, if you just look at like uh you know, aerospace like fighter jets and stuff, our black projects are like 30 years out. Mhm. You know, right. So, Right. They might have come up with something truly extraordinary. Is it 30 years out? about you thinking about it in like 1990 and 2000 times or is it 30 years out now because technology is obviously moving at an exponential pace. I mean it's still is it really still because 30 years from now I feel like we have a digital god. Yeah. No I can't believe that they're 30 years out. It's it's it's it's 30 for sure. Really? Yeah. And most multiple intelligence officials have told me even the people who are not dealing with UAP that are just working at like Defense Intelligence Agency they're like aerospace experts. They're looking at our they have to be aware of our black projects that are 30 years out and advers adversaries projects that are 30 years out and I mean that stuff's wild. I talked to a very senior intelligence official who is in his 80s who in the 70s mid70s was working on quantum entanglement for the CIA. What? Yeah. So no one heard about quantum entanglement I think until like 15 years ago. Yeah. So, how was he working on quantum entanglement? Didn't get in didn't get into the details. That was that was the headline I got. And it's a super serious guy, but that was the headline I got. He was doing he was doing fringe fringe science work dealing with quantum entanglement for the CIA and the DoD in the mid70s. And quantum entanglement as for what? Under what end? As a method of distribution of information? Unclear. Unclear. I wouldn't want to yeah wouldn't want to assume but just that was the headline and that's the it was said to me in the context of when the public hears about something existing it's it's long after it's existed in terms of black project science you know and and um so it just makes you think like you know if if things have come off the back of this technology and some of it has been commercialized actually like put into like what hypersonic missiles or whatever it is transistor radio whatever what hasn't you know what's just being kept in a in a box, you know. Um, that's pretty wild to think about. But the reality is I I mean, all of that leads me to just I really feel like if we get into this era of transparency and everyone knows it's real and all scientists know it's a valid area of inquiry and all the bright young minds out there that are in high school or college right now know this is something they can put their brain power towards, dude. So much amazing stuff could come out of it. Yeah. Like think about the uh space race. 35,000 inventions they say came out of the space race like velcro and bunch stuff, right? I think the fear would be that the openness would also lead to espionage, you know, because we already have a problem with that. We already have a problem with um agents of the CCP that infiltrate technology companies and get busted and it happens at universities. It's an issue, you know, and if it was open transparency and they were just bringing in all the brightest minds like, you know, maybe but maybe it's like the amnesty thing. Maybe it just needs to happen for the for the greater good. Yeah, that's the question. Like if they're both if both the United States and China are literally on the brink, maybe it's a conversation that needs to be had for the greater good of humanity. Yeah. You know, that this this notion that we are the only intelligent life that we've so far observed in the universe is a lie. and that whether where they come from, whether they're interdimensional or whe they're interstellar or whatever they are, there's something other than us that's more advanced than us, they can do things that we can't do and that we've learned from them. Yeah. And despite our differences, we have a lot in common in this situation and that we're all in it together. That's the Reagan speech. Yeah. Yeah. That famous Reagan speech at the UN. The two famous president's speeches that I now look through, you know, I look at in a completely different ways. Reagan's speech at the United Nations where he says, "I often think, you know, despite our differences, what would unite us is a threat from outside this planet." Yeah. You know, that brought us all together and remind us of our common bonds as humans, you know. But the other speech, um, well, first of all, that one, why do you often think that, Ronald Reagan? Right. Why is Reagan saying that? You're the president. Why are you often thinking that gave so many people hope? So many dorks like me. Like, yeah, maybe really Well, the other one is the Eisenhower speech about the military-industrial complex. Yes. Where he warned us. Mhm. M and he warned us at a time where we now know the legacy program was already getting very powerful and empowering defense contractors to reverse engineer technology. And he warns he says very very very uh clearly that the ability exists and will persist for unchecked power and that would threaten our democratic process and get us basically he's saying it'll get us to a place where the contractors are going to have more power than Congress. And here we are in 2025 with leaders in Congress and our Secretary of State saying that's literally what happened. That's literally the situation right now. The president is out of the mix. Congress is out of the mix. The people out of the mix and military contractors, the military-industrial complex is in control, has uncheck power and just waits out sitting presidents. Yeah. It's wild to listen to his his full speech through that context and know that that's what he was talking about. And it came to fruit. Yeah. Yeah. And it's 80 years later, we're like, "Oh, he was right." And the thing is that speech was he did that live on the air to the world and people didn't really get a chance to watch it until the internet because most people you'd have to read about it or you'd have to go somewhere and find some 35 mm footage and and strap it onto a you know projector and go watch him say that. Most people never saw it. You didn't see it until the internet came around and then people had encoded it and turned it into YouTube videos. Super powerful speech. There's a third one that I look through uh a different lens now which is not long before he was killed, Kennedy gave a speech about how secrecy is repentant in secret societies. Yes. Are he said are repentant in a free society and they challenge our democratic way of life and we shouldn't allow it. Yeah. You know, look where that got him. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. He was literally taking on secret societies. Yeah. I mean, he wanted to disband the CIA. He wanted there was he had a lot of ideas. Yeah. Yeah. I I look I I hope that people involved this at like the CIA or at these defense contractors realize like you said they have a moment here to be the heroes of the story. Yes. And to spin it and just say, "Hey, we were taking on a job that no one else knew existed. We were doing the best we could. We thought we made good decisions. Like any war, there's casualties of war, right? But our intention was to do the best for the United States. And we want to come out and tell everyone what we've learned in a safe way where we can share some information, educate the base, you know, the public with the base facts and then keep the rest classified for national security reasons. They would, these people would all just be, you know, heroes. Heroes. They they go down in history. We would be stunned, though. I mean, the United States, we I think if the full extent, if these people are telling the truth, the full extent of this cover up was ever revealed, we would probably be baffled. Like, wow. Like, they lied for so long. They covered up so much. And then there would be the anger at the misappropriation of funds and a lot of fingerpointing. And then there would be the very real problem of defense contractors getting access to backineered equipment where other defense contractors were not. So they would have an unfair advantage competitively. Yeah. I mean, look, a bunch of defense contractors went out of business over the years. Um, you'd also have to, you know, look back at some of the older defense contractors that were given materials in the 40s and 50s and then got acquired by a Northrup. You know, Lucky and Northrup bought all of the smaller defense contractors that have been involved with this over the years. Really? Yeah. Yeah. A bunch of them. So those are the big ones. Yeah. Locked and Northrup. Northrup. Rathon and um so didn't they all have access? Yeah, elements of them. I mean, you can't look at just like you can't look at the government as all one big entity. You can't look at like it's not like everybody at Lucky Martin knows about nonhuman technology, right? Um um but there are people that that are in control of that situation. And this comes from multiple people I interviewed in my film. They all said the exact same names. Jeez. Yeah. No, it's it's fascinating. the um how how did you ever go down how much of a rabbit hole have you gone down on the the remote viewing stuff? I've gone down a few a few rabbit holes. Yeah, it's fascinating what they have actually been able to do with it. Um the how put off story, but the crashed uh Soviet craft that they found that this remote viewer guy found like within a three mile radius located it exactly. Jimmy Carter put a statement out about it. Yeah, there's audio of Jimmy Carter telling that story. See if we can find that. It's wild, man. Yeah, we'll try to find that because that that is pretty crazy. But the other o the o the the thing that I find the most fascinating about it aside from just like it's real uh is the connection with UAP and there are people who have had UAP encounters and then end up with these abilities for remote view and and that is that is wild. So it's a a biological effect of of an encounter. Yeah. There's a big book that uh um I've been a part of developing that's gonna come out next year. Um it's a memoir. It's been publicized a little bit under a pseudonym. It's Scott Andrews is the name, but that's not his real name. Um he was a intelligence official who um as a kid had a UAP encounter and then um late in life um had a had a uh had a had a a medical issue that no one could explain. And then they found that he had these like amiebas in his body that should have killed him. Like there was no reason why he should be alive. And he had an immediate brain surgery. And after he had the brain surgery when he was healing, certain memories started to come back. And all of a sudden he was able to remote view. And he didn't understand what he was doing. He talked to some other intelligence officials who told him what you're doing is called remote viewing. People are trained to do that. But he was doing it like he had done it before like Jason Bourne like you know these skills are coming back, right? And um around that time he found uh when he was healing he's out of the hospital he found uh a locked file cabinet in his father's office. His father had passed away. In the cabinet was a bunch of files about his life organized by the year and amongst the files were his enlistment paperwork in the US Air Force as a child like 12 or 13 years old which is not legal. Yeah. and then his honorable discharge at 18 and the service code was Space Intelligence Communications and the base was the old Space Force base. Like straight up real documents and then he went to his mother who was still alive and said, "Do you know anything about this?" And she said, "I don't know anything about it, but she's like, "Do you remember when you were a kid and you saw that UFO?" And he he didn't really remember. She starts jogging his memory. She said, "You saw this UFO come out of this this lake." I think it was a lake or a pond. And um he's like, "I do now. Oh, I do remember. She remember you ran home and you told me and dad and and and she said, "All I know is the next day those men from the Air Force came to talk to you with your dad and then I never heard anything else about it." And so where this story goes is unpacking this connection between UAP encounters and, you know, while there's some biological effects that are bad, there are some that are also like, if you call it a gift, I don't know if you'd call it a gift or or curse, but like unlocking a potential. Unlocking a potential is a great way to put it. Yeah. And um and then the air force being the story also unveils how in on top of it the air force is. So they went and recruited this young kid and his father to become part of a secret program where we still don't know exactly what he did but he was used for this ability and the service code was space intelligence communications. And it's a wild story. There's a lot more to it. I could talk to you about it for like four hours but it's one of the most mind-blowing stories ever. this specific person is extremely high ranking. Like his resume reads like a movie character. It's like it's it's bonkers. He's like, you know, at one point he was running like I don't remember the exact title, but essentially he was like running counterterrorism for North America. He's like a really high level dude. And um he ended up getting because of his stature in the intelligence community, he ended up getting help from people in the Department of Defense to piece together this hidden past he has and he actually is in the process of getting approved for anonymous health injury status from the Secretary of Defense. So this program that he was involved in as a child, does he have any recollection? No recollection. his his wife is was like a gum shoe detective about it. She starts calling um they see in the in the files there was um records of days of school he missed excused absences for huge periods of time. I don't remember exactly whether it was weeks or months but it was huge periods of time. So his wife calls the school and starts digging and asks um you know what was your policy back then? Like would someone have had to repeat a grade if they missed this much time? And they said absolutely unless you had um a really good reason or some sort of like med like serious medical excuse like you would have been held back. He was never held back. He has no memory of missing all these days of school. His friends that he grew up with don't remember it but there's all this documentation of it. His friends don't remember him not being at school. No weird they inquired. Yeah. Totally weird. Totally weird. Totally weird. Um, so has he undergone hypnotic regression? He hasn't done that. He's been dealing with a lot of serious medical issues like very serious like almost almost dying multiple times from a lot of these um um the correct word by the way is parasites. I think I said amiebas parasites. He has par he had parasites in his body that almost killed him multiple times. What kind of parasites? Um there was seven different parasites that he and his doctor said his doctor told him would have killed him within a month. I don't remember the exact names. I wouldn't pretend to be a you know medical scientist or anything like that. Did does he have any suspicions as to how he acquired these parasites? Yeah, he thinks that whatever program he was involved with did did bizarre experiments. That's what he thinks. And he thinks that he was supposed to not remember any of this. And when the parasite issues caused brain surgery, the memories came back. Yeah. And he ended up there there's a lot more to the story after he after he started socializing what he was experiencing. Um there were multiple attempts on his life that have been documented and investigated by real intelligence agencies. He's like a serious dude and he's he's doing his tell all memoir. Um it's a it's a really great book. It's almost done and Simon Shusher is going to publish it next year. So there's multiple attempts on his life because of which as does he have an understanding like was he threatened? He thinks it's because what he was involved with was supposed to stay in the past. He wasn't supposed to remember it when he was a child. Yeah. No one. And so they want to kill him. Wouldn't that make it even more suspicious? Well, depends on how you Yeah. No, probably not. Probably not because they could just get away with it. Yeah. What kind of attempts on his life? Um directed energy weapons. What? Yeah. Yeah. Like how the guy was having the actual symptoms of a directed energy weapon attack and he knew what those circumstances were from his you know from his career. He knew these were symptoms of that and they a proper investigation was done by real authorities and they found evidence of it like etching in the windows and etching in the windows. Yeah. If a direct weapon goes through glass it causes etching in the windows. So they literally physically targeting him with something from a drone from space. Who know who knows? I mean that's these are like the list of questions that this story So the idea is like let's just give this guy cancer or just nuke him and take him out. That's what it seems. Yeah. Because he's talking too much about this program. That's what it seems. And then if it comes out we're [ __ ] Yeah. That's what it seems because probably what they did is highly illegal, especially if they did it to a child. Well, I don't think you can legally enlist in the military when you're, you know, also 13. He probably wasn't the only one. Yeah. Yeah. And so if they do have some sort of ability to erase memory, that's what it would seem. Which also lines up with, you know, I talked to um one of the stories I left out of the film. I talked to the base commander from Rendlessham, the the US joint US UK base in the UK where there was a huge UAP event in the 80s and the base commander told me on the record on camera that the day after the event an airplane landed um people from the CIA and Air Force intelligence showed up with authority and demanded to speak to the witnesses and the base commander was told to leave the room. He didn't know until years later that all those servicemen that experienced this, they were all told to to um share the details and they were given a drug. I think it was called is this correct? Sodium penthol. Is that how you say it? Penithol. Yeah. Is that that's the truth serum, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And they were given that to to to um share what they what they experienced. And then they were all asked if they had ever been hypnotized. And someone was there who hypnotized them. As crazy as that sounds. Wow. This is the base commander telling me this on camera to my face. He also said they took away something in crates the next day on this airplane and he never got clarity on what it was. He and the third thing that he revealed that I don't think anyone's ever talked about with Randles is he revealed that the day after the ba the event he went and he talked to the people in the communications room, you know, old school like wires in the wall and stuff. and uh the head of the communications on the base told him that the entire night of the event while he was out in the woods dealing with the event um the whole base was on um communication lockdown all lines were shut down except the direct line between the base and the White House which it's called I believe I believe I don't want to mess this up but I believe it's called flash override which is only used for nuclear war or imminent threat of nuclear war. So, like the most extreme circumstances where you need a direct line between the base and the president. Whoa. Yeah. So, one of the unfortunate things I had to cut for time, hardest thing about making this movie, man, was my director's cut was like four hours and I had to get this down. I had to cut this down to something that was like consumable. Did you ever think about making it like a se like a Netflix thing or multi-piece? I did. I did think about it. Um, what about a director's cut? Would you ever do that? I'll probably I'll think about doing that. Or maybe let's do a sequel. Maybe let's do a follow-up and put some of the stuff that like is like a bridge too far into the next thing once once the table's been set. That sounds good. You know, this was the question I was going to get to with that. Now, you've worked on legitimate films. Yeah. Like not that this isn't legitimate, but you worked on some like big blockbuster Hollywood films. Ready Player One. Amazing film. I love that movie. Um, are you locked into this kind of [ __ ] now? Cuz here's the problem that happens when people start going down this rabbit hole. It kind of consumes them. Look, it's definitely it's definitely been a consuming endeavor this movie. I mean, this thing has consumed my life for four years. And I had to, you know, it's a whole another conversation, but I had to make this movie in secrecy because at the at the offset when I started getting real intell, it's not in your best interest to promote the fact you're doing this. Don't announce people doing it. Don't let the world know about it until you put a trailer out. You know, there's going to be people who are going to try to cause problems for you. So, I had to make this in secrecy. I end up doing post out of my house which um my fiance my fiance is a saint. Ally Feinstein is a saint for putting up with that. Did you have a crew at your house doing all the post? Wow. And it was so you had to do it on the sneak all consuming and um and yes it this this topic is a rabbit hole you become consumed with. I I look I'm still gonna do movies and TV shows that have nothing to do with UAP for sure and I'm developing some and I and I and I and I think I'll probably make some next year but um at the same time I want to do more in this space and these adjacent spaces like I'm doing like I mentioned J Stratton's book I'm working really hard on I'm also going to develop a series based on J Stratton's life which is this remarkable 16-year rabbit hole of investigating non-human intelligent life and UAP for the US government. Um, I'm working with some other people that are in my film on on their life stories and then the book I just told you about that crazy remote viewing story. Yeah. I'm developing a movie about that. Oh, like a fiction like dramatization. Yeah. Like picture like the vibe of the insider, the Russell Crow Aluccino movie, but with that story like that kind of vibe, right? Who want to play that guy? Do you guys in mind? I have a few people in mind. Don't want to say too soon. There's a few people in mind. Russell Crow. Russell Crow be amazing for it and he's really into the topic. Oh yeah, he really topic and he's only interested in doing interesting things now. Yeah, you know. Yeah, he's got all the money in the world. He's he he he'd be amazing for it. Um there's a lot of good ideas for that one. Um but I do want to I do want to still do, you know, stuff outside this topic for sure. I'm really fascinated with the remote viewing topic. I think I have a desire to do in the same way that the age of disclosure is the definitive doc on what we now know that can be le law lawfully disclosed about UAP and not human intelligent life. I really want to try to endeavor to do that version of the remote viewing story. That would be amazing. Like the super credible nonensational it's got I mean it's got the coolest setup for here. Here's the setup for this thing. So Hal Pudof's working for the CIA and the DoD in the mid70s. He's doing some spooky stuff, fringe science work. His CIA handler, who's his best friend and was in his wedding party, comes into his office, knocks on the door, and says, "We've got a problem we need your help with." He says, "What is it?" He says, "Our operatives have found out that the Russians have a program that they're 10 years into where they have rounded up the best psychics in Russia and they've trained them to use their psychic abilities to spy on American bases and our most secure facilities and they're getting actionable intel." How's of course like, "Holy [ __ ] that's the craziest thing I've ever heard, right?" And the CIA guy says, "Yes, you've got a blank checkbook from the CIA and the DoD. you've got x amount of time to catch up on their 10-year program. We've got to beat them. He had then has to figure out like how to go about finding people who have these abilities because it's not like Russia where we just go round up a bunch of people and say you're going to do this, right? So, he comes up with a clever system to bake into army basic training testing that can identify people with these skill sets and then you can pluck them up and have them come work for this program. You can help them sharpen their skill sets and you can train them to become remote viewers. to me that like that scene it's like it's like the Indiana Jones scene where where the CIA comes in Indiana Jones and says you know what do you know about the Ark of the Covenant you know oh my god and we've got this situation we need your help with you know it's wild man it's like the craziest setup of all time and it's fascinating and then the fact that they started getting real actionable intelligence that they were acting on like the CIA was running missions based on his intel one one of one day when I shot I did so many interviews with Hal but one day when we finished um talking about the UAP topic. I had I had intentionally scheduled a few extra hours and I was like, "All right, Al, let's talk about Stargate." And I grabbed like three hours of the entire Stargate story and it's [ __ ] mind-blowing. And the all the specific like little stories of action that were taken based on their intel, it is so wild and so compelling. And then when Stargate, at the time, Stargate was a deeply hidden program, extremely secret, highly classified. There was some leak I think that happened in the 90s where people heard about it and then essentially the government said, "Oh, it's not real. It didn't work. It was a thing we tried, you know, and all they did is they just moved it to another agency." As far as I've had so many people tell me of their awareness of active remote viewing programs. Wow. Yeah. Have you tried to do it? I have not tried to do it. Why not? But I did, what I did try was someone remote viewing me in a specific place where I was and they sent me a picture that they sketched out that gave me [ __ ] chills cuz they described exactly where I was standing when I was talking to them. And I don't think they had cameras in my house, which is the obvious question, right? Pretty wild. And I've and there's others there's other stories that I've heard from intelligence officials that I I've gotten close with because of the UAP topic. people who became aware of the remote viewing situation and would tell me these just like little stories like there was a there was a here's like a specific there was a there was a pen drive like a little you know little little drive with some data on it that had some UAP data on it that an intelligence official literally dropped while hiking out of their pocket. It was in their pocket and and they dropped it and they used a remote viewer to help them find it and told them exactly where it was and went and found it. It's crazy. It's crazy. It's crazy. It's crazy. But then you go and you listen to this clip of Jimmy Carter talking about how remote viewers were used to find this down airplane and you're like, "This guy was president of the United States." I definitely found a transcript in an article, but I think this is audio and I hadn't been able to check it. There is a documentary. Let's see. I tried to find a documentary and there's a documentary called Third Eye Spy that has it as the opening of They described it differently than change and inexplicable event that has been discussed publicly is one time we had a a small plane go down somewhere in Africa. We needed very much to find out where that plane had crashed and we were not able to find it by surveillance from our satellites. So the director of the CIA, he was also director of all the intelligence agencies, heard about a a woman in California that uh was a medium and he uh contacted her and she gave him the latitude and longitude of the plane's whereabouts. And the next time one of our space satellites went over that area, we located the plane where she said it was. That's cool. By the way, that's not even the one I was thinking of. He he says it about a different thing about a plane went down. I think it was Russia. Uh and he specifically says, "We went to the remote viewing program for one of the best remote viewers and they they found it." But that's crazy. That's a sitting president. Oh, right. [ __ ] Jimmy Carter talking about a psychic being used to Yeah. It's Do you think that that is an aspect of human consciousness that we used to be able to do? I do. And that we've lost it somehow. Yeah. Yeah. I think there's just things we've evolved out of and things we've evolved into. And I think that that's, you know, um is that what they think as well? Yeah. Yeah. Someone someone someone very involved in in that topic for the government now told me the analogy they would make is it's like if if if you saw a basketball on the ground, anybody can go pick the basketball up. If there's a hoop there, they can throw it at it. Right. Right. If you sat back and watched a line of 100 people do it, someone would look like clowns. Someone would someone be like, "Oh, this guy has sign of potential." And then, you know, one out of every however many, like thousand, whatever, it would be a Michael Jordan who's just like boom, swish. This guy's a [ __ ] natural, right? Got this instinct. So, everyone can do it. everyone can pick up the ball and throw it at the hoop. And some people have a natural instinct to do it better. And that's what they were trying to identify. And that's what they do try to identify. And the weird one is that people who have had encounters. Yeah. So that's that to me is like like it breaks through some barrier that you have in your consciousness when they communicate with you. All of a sudden now you have this wall that has been downed that allows you to have access to this forgotten aspect of human consciousness or it somehow heightens it, you know, like so it's the biological effects are real. So we don't, you know, we know about the bad ones like cancer, but maybe one of the other ones is it heightens this ability somehow. Have you ever taken any time into consideration of the possibility that human beings were were a product of genetic engineering? I mean to it's it's kind of impossible to go down this this rabbit hole and not not have the thought of are we just all a big is this a big experiment right you know and one day the experiment will end or not even just an experiment or but an aiding in a process like they recognize a process where there's bipeedal homminids Yeah. of various intelligence and they accentuate that. Yeah. And in multiple different probably multiple different attempts. Yeah. I mean, I've I've definitely thought about it and I and I it would explain a lot. You know, there's all these missing gaps in our history. Well, that's also the weirdness of the book of Enoch. Yeah. The Book of Enoch is essentially describing watchers who come down from the sky and mate with women. Yeah. Well, that if you told that story for a thousand years and the real story was they came down, they got a hold of human babies and and human mothers and introduced genetics that were alien into into these children. That would be like they mated with women. Yeah. It would be kind of the same thing. Yeah. You know, and created Well, they they talk about the Nephilim giants who destroyed everything, but that's kind of us. Well, the other thing that makes me think of is uh a number of the people who have seen crafts and it's uh Jay Stratton and LZando say it in the film that the craft at Roswell had hieroglyphics on it, some kind of ancient writing. And they they actually uh I didn't put it in the film, but they talked about how when they learned that to be a fact, they spent a ton of time researching ancient texts and trying to find a match, and they couldn't find it. And the closest thing they could find was some old biblical text. Um, but whose hieroglyphics were these? What was that from? Yeah, it's wild, man. Well, how much would you give to see one to like please I I'll stop making documentaries. I won't talk to nobody. Just show me just take me into the hanger and show me this [ __ ] thing. Spielberg Spielberg says he's, you know, all these years a guy made Close Encounters. made ET, you know, War of the Worlds, um, TV shows, um, about it and never seen one. And, you know, have you had anything that you've ever seen that you thought was weird? Yeah. Yeah, I have. I um, actually out in Ohigh. Out in Ohio, my uh, my fiance and I were laying on a on a blanket while I was making this movie um, looking at stars and saw what looked like a satellite. At first I thought it was going slow and then this thing just [ __ ] rocketed off way up there. All it looked like was a star, but it was not a star. It was not a satellite cuz it moved super fast and just darted across the sky out of nowhere. Yeah. Up right above the topa mountains in Ohio. And then I and then I actually the next day we said to the staff, we were on those little golf carts getting drove across this hotel property and we told him we saw and the guy goes, "Yeah, not going to lie, we've see that stuff a lot out here." I was like, "Wow, fascinating." Yeah. But that's the only thing I ever saw. Other other stuff where I'm like witnessing firsthand the craziness of this cover up. Uh one of the interview subjects I had at my house in Los Angeles prepping for an interview. We're in the middle of we're sitting my living room. I I live in the suburbs of of of Los Angeles and uh what happened is not normal. Heard a very loud helicopter. Ran outside, had my phone on me, look look up and there's a black helicopter right above my house. And the guy comes out of the house and looks up and then without missing a beat I always remember this. He's like he's like yeah that'll happen. I'm like what what the hell did I get into? You know. So they're essentially letting you know that they know. Yeah. There's been a bunch of moments like that. Like yeah letting letting you know. That's that's the message. I I I immediately ask people on the Senate Intelligence Committee and Senator Arm Services Committee about that if I should be worried. They're basically like they're just letting you know that they're aware what you're doing. It's them sending a message. They're watching you. Try not to cross any lines. They're like, "That happens to everybody on the intelligence committee." I would imagine that those people though kind of want you to succeed. They want you to succeed in a way where you're not crossing your lines. And look, I went to great lengths. I no one says anything classified on camera for me. There's none of that. I don't want to be I want any part of that, right? They only share what they lawfully can. And I think that, you know, I I assumed after that that every phone call and every email was being observed. Oh, yeah. And not only did I assume that, but I was I was told to assume that. Yeah. I'm sure. Yeah. The people on the So, there's a guy I'll give him a shout out, John Estrich, who was on the Senate Intelligence Committee staff. He was the senior staffer for Rubio. He was the guy who really um led the charge on looking into this topic for Rubio and Warner on the Senate Intelligence Committee staff. He was extremely supportive to me behind the scenes. Helped vet people for me, helped send introductions my way, helped validate me with Rubio and rounds. Extremely helpful. He often had that same kind of activity at his house every time he'd have an important meeting. Yeah. Yeah. And uh Oh god, that'll [ __ ] put some holes in your sales. Yeah. You know, you're like, "Slow down. Maybe maybe I need to go back to Ready Player 2. Going to go develop an Oceans 11 type movie. And yeah, I'm not interested in [ __ ] helicopters being over my house. No, there's been there's been Look, there's a lot of people I don't want to go too into it, but as you can imagine, there's a lot of people that didn't that wish this movie didn't exist. I'm sure. Yeah. That wish I never made it, of course. That tried to prevent it from getting released and went out of their way to cause problems. There's a lot of people that fit that description and I became aware of a lot of them. I became aware of a lot of those those concerns and I just kind of like I just kind of put blinders on and like you know had tunnel vision was like all right I'm not doing anything illegal. I'm not going to do anything that's bad for the United States. I'm not I think it's good for the United States. I really do. I think what that film is good for just human beings overall. I it's it's really important man and I'm glad you did it. It was really excellent. Thank you. I'm glad I got to see it at South by Southwest and and I was like, man, this has got to get distributed. Like, how does this get out there? Yeah. You know, despite South by we did two screenings, 1100 seats at the Parammont Theater, standing ovations, lines around the block. The trailer I put out in January quickly got like 20 million views. Despite that, all the major distributors and major streamers, they watched it, they loved it, they said all these great things, but then they didn't end up they didn't end up moving forward. and and and you know I don't think it's naive to think that um other parties you know might have discouraged people. Yes, I would imagine that. Um how can people watch it? So on Friday the 21st which is tomorrow which is tomorrow or today depending on when this drops it'll drop today. So it's today for people listening and watching today. February 20 Jesus February today. November 21st. They've got an amoeba in your brain, bro. to today, November 21st, worldwide on Prime Video. You can rent it, you can buy it. I made subtitles for every single major language. It's available in every single country around the world where Prime Video is available and you can also see it in the movie theater in New York, Los Angeles, and DC. And I really encourage everyone in the world to watch this thing and make it a conversation with their friends and family. I think it's the most interesting conversation you can have around Thanksgiving dinner next week. You know, it is really good, Ben. and you should be very proud of it and I hope it gets distributed even wide wider after the success of the Amazon Prime thing because I think it's going to take off. Thank you. Yeah, I I I hope that's the case and and yeah, I do think there'll be a follow-up. Let's do that follow-up, baby. Come back and and definitely if you do a remote viewing one, too. I want to hear about more. Hell yeah. Hell yeah. Hell yeah. Thank you very much for being here, man. It was awesome. Your documentary is really really excellent. Thank you both. I appreciate it. Bye, everybody. Bye. [Music]